“Ubuntu is the Linux distro that seems to be on everyones lips these days, but until now I’ve not really given it a chance. What’s so special about this distro that’s making everyone nuts over it? How has it risen so fast on DistroWatch’s Hit Ranking? I was about to find out the answers to these questions and get a feel for Debian’s newest kid on the block.” Read more here. Update: Another one here.
First Look At Ubuntu Linux 5.04 Array-4
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
Out of the box, I’d say this is one of the worst looking distributions I’ve ever reviewed. I’m guessing that the color choices they made were in keeping with an “Earthy” feel, but I didn’t find it attractive at all.
It’s always interesting to see how subjective people’s opinion on what is beautiful. E.g. he’s previously reviewed Turbolinux: http://www.madpenguin.org/images/reviews/turbo10f/defaultdesk.png
I guess some people just don’t like earth colors
I love the ubuntu colours, but I realise that some people don’t
I do not HATE the theme, but I do tend to switch it out for something a bit more blue… I know this sounds so dumb, but the Ubuntu desktop seems to plain at first… Robust and useful, just kinda plain.
i prefer earth tone colors like that of Ubuntu, the browns, tans, greens, greys, charcoals, black, oranges…
colors that are loud and “in your face” are a turn off to me…
So he didn’t like the theme, that it didn’t ship the KDE apps you want by default, and what else?
* “I don’t feel that it’s quite “there” yet, if you know what I mean?”
* “it just doesn’t do it for me”
* “but are very young”
His biggest complaint seems to be that unlike Libranet and Xandros, the Ubuntu devs contributes back to Debian. His “solution” is what, to make proprietary devations from Debian instead of folding back patches upstream? Um… yeah, okay. Hey, I guess each of us is entitled to an opinion.
I can’t help but think he set out to *not like* ubuntu. He stated it was a gnome centric distro that was highly specialized (i.e. not 4 apps for 1 purpose). He then complained about the lack of qt based apps (understandable in a gnome distribution), that the default theme wasn’t to his taste (hardly a huge problem), then the lack of bleeding edge beta software, then finally concluded with its not “quite there yet”. Quite where exactly? Somewhere for him only obviously.
…but I installed it for my neighbours after their XP had died by unprotected Internet exposure. Had my first printing in Linux experience:) I managed to rescue their Word documents using the live-cd and they could keep working on them in Open Office. Their digital camera mounted as a USB drive. So far a successful operation:)
Most of the apps that were “missing” are under the universe repository, which he even enables later. I like ubuntu because it doesn’t use any kde apps. Not that kde apps are bad, but they belong in kde.
If you do KDE, then what’s the freaking point of even installing it.
In any case, I just upgraded to Hoary a couple nights ago, and to Xorg , 2.6.10 kernel last night. The whole thing was very smooth. Ubuntu is a very slick, fast desktop.
He gave it 3/5 for useability? Just what distro was he using? Obviously not the same Ubuntu Hoary I’m running now.
Throughout the review he talks about all the great features it has (such as the USB detection, and kernel config) then says it lacks features?
As for running Ubuntu on 266mhz, well, that just shows stupidity and ignorance.
Complaining about how it looks by default is silly. The default is a standard, clean Gnome desktop, if he doesn’t like the wallpaper then right-click and change it, that takes 5 seconds.
Overall it sounds like he loves KDE and yet went to a Gnome-only distro looking for things to moan about. I say Gnome-only, more Gnome-centric, KDE runs great and ofcourse icewm,*box,xfce etc are all available and take 2 minutes to install (without you having to do a thing) through Synaptic.
This review was a waste of time.
Am I alone that who is thinking that his comments aren’t match with his overall rating. It’s not that I am complaining or trolling, but I find that was a bit strange when I saw the overall rating right after I read his review.
It sounds like this guy just didn’t want to like Ubuntu from the start – probably because it’s #1 on distrowatch or he’s a KDE user (he says he’s “oodling around in Gnome but uses a lot of KDE apps”), and then goes on to say look at Xandros and Libranet – bah.
Ubuntu has things wrong with it, but there are major problems here.
First of all, I _just_ installed Array 4 on my Mom’s computer. By default, the only packages that are available are the ones _ON YOUR UBUNTU CD_. Of course the selection is small. But if you edit sources.list to include the main Ubuntu repository, universe and even multiverse, you get access to EVERYTHING in the Debian archives, and then some.
Considering that and his “subjective” view of how it looks were his two major complaints, it seems he just didn’t have any complaints at all.
Remember this is a development release.
Oh, and Ubuntu isn’t “just Debian.” It’s “Gnome-focused Debian which follows the GNOME release schedule.” There is no point to using Ubuntu if you want to just use KDE, you are better off using debian-installer and pure Debian.
Ubuntu is a great out of the box distro. It works and is functional althougha little reading is required to get media up and running ie mp3’s and DVD’s.
Where it falls down at the moment is in dealing with proprietry graphics drivers. I know this is against the Ubuntu/Debian philosophy but some of us like to use proprietry drivers and their support in Ubuntu Hoary is at the moment a joke. Pity as it is so good in other areas.
Where it falls down at the moment is in dealing with proprietry graphics drivers. I know this is against the Ubuntu/Debian philosophy but some of us like to use proprietry drivers and their support in Ubuntu Hoary is at the moment a joke. Pity as it is so good in other areas.
I have never had problems dealing with proprietary drivers in Ubuntu.
I just completed my Warty to Hoary upgrade last night…finally going to 2.6.10 and xorg. First I used synaptic to install the kernel and rebooted, then I got all the xorg stuff including the xorg-ati-drivers and restarted X. Everything worked fine.
Proprietary drivers are in the “restricted” component. What card are you having trouble with? Have you filed a bug report?
I am posting on the Ubuntu Development forum. Still some things need to be tried.
The Card is a GeForce Ti4400
Kernel is 2.6.10 K7 SMP for my dual AMD system.
I get Hoary booting into the GDM login screen but my monitor goes blank and into a power down state. I know the login screen is occuring as I can hear the audio. I have posted my xorg.conf on the forum and there is mention that there are no horizontal/vertical ranges for it. Still the xorg nv driver has no issue with it and that is what the default install gave me.
How did you install the drivers? You should just install nvidia-glx with synaptic and then run “sudo nvidia-glx-config enable” That simple. Has worked on several computers for me.
Is it possible that your monitor is being powered down by DPMS? You could try disabling DPMS in your /etc/X11/xorg.conf. It’s worth a shot 🙂
Quote: “His biggest complaint seems to be that unlike Libranet and Xandros, the Ubuntu devs contributes back to Debian”
I beg your pardon? Do a search on Jon Danzig or Tal Danzig on google and see how many come back with Debian responses. None of the add-ins for Libranet are ‘hidden’, they’re mostly perl and bash shell scripts taking advantage of getting things easy to do. In fact I was unable to find anything about copyright etc, so in theory you could copy the Libranet adminmenu most probably onto Debian or other Debian based distros. Of course that wouldn’t be very nice. More to the point (since your distro bashing in your response), how many nice tools has Ubuntu done? Or are they all standard Debian stuff…and don’t give me that bullshit about Gnome having all the necessary tools thanks…
Quote: “That is the worst thing I’ve ever read.. What a waste of time.”
He didn’t like it, get it? It’s his review and his opinion. If you don’t like it tough luck, he’s entitled to his viewpoint/opinion.
Quote: “I like ubuntu because it doesn’t use any kde apps. Not that kde apps are bad, but they belong in kde.”
You like Gnome, fine. And if i’m a kde user? No kde in the Ubuntu distro by default doesn’t suit me. So I dislike Ubuntu because of that. But you’re allowed to not have KDE in it cos you don’t like KDE. And if I fault Unbuntu because of that I get hammered by the Ubuntu lovers. A bit hypocritcal eh?
Dave
Its simply the easiest and fastest distro that dual would dual install on my eMac. That and the fact it just works with GNUstep, made me a believer immediately. It installed with my OSX and FreeBSD in a matter of hours, where other distros either didn’t install or took what seemed like days.
You like Gnome, fine. And if i’m a kde user?
then you shouldnt use a GNOME-only distro.
but a bit of research will show you that theres a new project called KUBUNTU which will produce a KDE centered ubuntu ISO.
http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/Kubuntu/
On the topic of installations, I’d like to point out something the Ubuntu developers should take to heart considering the goal of making this an ultra-friendly Debian distribution: Create a GUI installer. While many of us might not really need one (I surely don’t mind either way, as long as it does what it’s supposed to do), a distro focused on being ‘friendly’ might do well to have one. Like I mentioned earlier, a newbie could easily install Ubuntu with some work, but a GUI might be more well-suited for this distro.
Does it really matter? Text based does not automatically mean user-unfriendly. Instead of pointing and clicking, you simply use the arrows and return key. Not hard to figure out. Hell, even the NT/2000/XP installation uses this mode in the early stages of installation. If someone is incapable of figuring out something even this simple, should they really be installing operating systems to begin with?
“To my dismay, it wasn’t on the list of available packages to install. Neither were many other applications I looked for. XMMS was missing (I know it’s an old application, but I like it)”
Ummm its on the Synaptic list for me???? Check your scroll bar all the way down by the X’s …..
a couple of thoughts (from a ubuntu user perspective)
-I agree with Brian: i use PC since the old time of DOS, so im not scared by text/ncurses install and i dont think we need a GUI for the installer. I think that the installer should be CLEAR. What I mean? Ubuntu installer is easy to use, aptitude is a pain in the a.. so we can have textual installer easy to use and understand, and textual apps (installer) that are messed up
-David, as ubuntupr0n said, if you dont want a gnome-centric distro, go for MEPIS (or whatever else) or wait for Kubuntu
-I think that review is quite bad: you dont find Amarok? so why dont you try Rhythmbox and stop complaining about missing kde-stuff?
-Im currently using a Hoary on my laptop, no problem installing, it correctly detected my orinoco during installation and asked my gently if i wanted to configure and use it for further installations
PS Warty had some problems with my videocard/display -> error installing X
a quick addition before people start whining: i know aptitude is not a distro installer, it was just an example of what i consider a not-so-easy-to-use textual app
Guys,
You missed my point entirely. I see no reason why Ubuntu itself should not offer KDE packages, installed, by default, and allow the user to pick.
You tell me however that if I don’t like Ubuntu being a Gnome only desktop (by initial install) then bugger off and pick something else. That’s the usual Gnome elitism. And it’s one reason why I dislike Ubuntu and do not and will not recommend it. It presumes to tell the user what’s good for him/her and if they don’t like it tough luck. Not my cuppa tea.
You should have heard all the Gnome users bitching about Slackware when Pat said he dislikes Gnome and it’s a bitch to update and maintain and he’s thinking of dropping it entirely from Slackware. The amount of moaning and whinging was unbelievable. And here I have the same type of Gnome users tell me tough luck if Ubuntu is Gnomecentric – don’t use it and go elsewhere. Talk about hypocrisy.
A good distro is (in my eyes, and many others) a good and solid mixture of packages that will please the majority of the masses.
This reviewer felt there was issues with Ubuntu, the very same issues that I feel. It’s his review and if people don’t like it tough luck. It’s very obvious to my eyes that Ubuntu is doing so well because of the Gnome implementation, the Gnome users like it because of this feature, but from a general point of view it’s not really acceptable. That’s not being anti Gnome, it’s being reasonable and holistic in my approach.
Of course people will tell me that Ubuntu is not my distro, and I have no right to tell the Ubuntu developers what to do. That is true. But I certainly won’t consider their product, in fact i’m a very happy Libranet user, and have been for 18 months now and have NO intentions of changing. Libranet does everything that I need to do.
Dave
David,
im not a Gnome elitist and i dont do religion wars about licences (i use Windows on a daily base and Ubuntu is the *first* ditro i use with Gnome; i used Kde on others) so im not that kind of person, trust me
My idea is that there are so many distros that they should be a bit “specialized”: i prefer having a distro like Ubuntu that is optimized around Gnome, with a small selection of good software: Firefox, Evolution (but i use Tbird so i could switch to it if i need) etc.. than having multiple distros offering everything you can find on the linux world.
That’s my idea, and probably (up to the moment i read they’re workin on Kubuntu) the same idea of Ubuntu hackers. I like this approach, that could be seen, i.e. in Cobind Desktop (never tried it, only seen on the site) that should be an XFCE-based distro with a small selection of good software.
I know there are various distros that ships with both Kde and Gnome, but you should agree that many of them are specifically “configured” around Kde, offering you themes, config utils and so on that works only/best with Kde. Yes you can install/use Gnome on those, but how many do it?
I dont know what will happen with Kubuntu, but i liked the Ubuntu approach. What i meant to say is this: you know Ubuntu is gnome-centric so you know what you’ll find when you install it. If you dont like its approach to Linux, i dont think it’s a good idea to install it and then complain, dont you agree? It’s like installing Gentoo and the whining about having to compile everything…so why did you choose Gentoo?!?
Ecio
I agree entirely with what you were saying about the gnome fanboys.
I use Ubuntu on one of my pcs, I love it for what it is, a gnome centered distro.
However, I am keeping it purely gnome as a trial. There are things I cannot do, and there are things that I can do, in a round about way.
On another machine I have SimplyMepis installed and keep that purely kde. No problems there.
BUT and it is a big but….
My main machine runs Mandrake 10.1, and I use kde on that… but with a good mixture of gnome programs that I like to use.
Fanboys always come on and give abuse about mixing, giving the old excuse that the shared libraries are wasting my memory and slowing my computer down. Well, guess what ? I don’t care.
If I want to mix and match to use my pc the way I want, so what ?
Yesterday, in a swift motion of generosity, I set up a folding table in fron of my garage lane and started giving away cheesecakes with berries topping. Most of the people appreciated them alot, telling me that it was a really good cheescake, one of the best cheesecakes with berries they had ever tasted. I kept baking them and refining the recipe, tryign to make even better cheesecakes. Then I started getting complaints: a guy came and told me that it was a decent pie, but that what he really wanted was a Sachertorte. He said that I should not dare choosing the pie for him, that I should bake both cheesecakes and Sacher and keep them both in my kitchen and each person would choose which pie they wanted from me. And I mumbled something along the lines “But… but… I’m giving them away for free and I like cheesecakes and I’m trying to make really _good_ cheesecakes. It would take me time to learn to bake a Sacher. I’m pretty sure some of my equally generous neighbours can give you better Sachers than I can right now? They can even borrow my ingredients and recipe book if they want to. Maybe one day when I have time?” But the guy turned on his heels and left, calling me an ‘bloody cheesecake-centric elitist’.
It’s a strange world that of free pies, isn’t it?
One of the best replies I’ve seen on osnews comments in a long time!
Does Anyone know where can I get this wallpaper from the second review?
http://www.mrroboto.org/images/ubuntu2.jpg
IT ROCKS. Thanks
Thank you Kitty, great post (of course It is, your Ip says you come from Italy
)
Quote: “I know there are various distros that ships with both Kde and Gnome, but you should agree that many of them are specifically “configured” around Kde, offering you themes, config utils and so on that works only/best with Kde. Yes you can install/use Gnome on those, but how many do it? ”
Yes. However, Libranet allows me kde, xfce, icewm, icewm (customised by Libranet), Gnome, blackbox, fluxbox, enlightenment…if Libranet can do it then others can as well, any other excuse is bullshit. You give your user choice. That’s what Linux and open source are meant to be about. Of course, that choice…leads to my next quote:
Quote: “It’s like installing Gentoo and the whining about having to compile everything…so why did you choose Gentoo?!?
”
True. And I wouldn’t install Gentoo for that reason. Just as I wouldn’t install Ubuntu for the reasons i’ve outlined in prior posts. What I am doing is in effect, agreeing with the reviewer [in question], and voicing my arguments for why I don’t chose Ubuntu. Kubuntu is the same – it’s solely for kde, I like to choose, not be told what to use.
I personally cannot really enjoy using Gnome, it just doesn’t do it for me for a variety of reasons. For those that like Gnome, great! Use what works for you.
Dave
Quote: “It’s a strange world that of free pies, isn’t it?
”
Good for you. However, I like the ability to choose. Ubuntu does not offer that to my eyes, and again, as this article is about the review that the reviewer posted, which seems to have upset the vocal crowd of Ubuntu supports, i’ve posted my thoughts [in alignment with the reviewer], for the same exact reasons.
I guess it’s like love, you never really see how bad a person can be when you’re in love, but when you’re no longer in love [with that person] you see all of their faults. Since i’m not in love with Ubuntu, I see the faults [or at least what I perceive as being faults].
Ubuntu has many strong followers, I wonder what will happen if lots of users leave Debian for Ubuntu over the next 2-3 years as Debian becomes more and more sunken into the quagmire of slow or non existant updates. And Debian starts to collapse due to developers moving to Ubuntu…
Dave
> Ubuntu has many strong followers, I wonder what will happen
> if lots of users leave Debian for Ubuntu over the next 2-3
> years as Debian becomes more and more sunken into the
> quagmire of slow or non existant updates. And Debian starts
> to collapse due to developers moving to Ubuntu…
Ubuntu for the Desktop, Debian for the Server, where’s the Problem??
You can get the Ubuntchie wallpaper here:
http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=14461
mine is modified for the dual monitor desktop
cheers
Quote: “Yes. However, Libranet allows me kde, xfce, icewm, icewm (customised by Libranet), Gnome, blackbox, fluxbox, enlightenment…if Libranet can do it then others can as well, any other excuse is bullshit. You give your user choice. That’s what Linux and open source are meant to be about. Of course, that choice…”
Ok but…do you switch wm/DE every minute? I think that when you choose a desktop environment you’ll use it for a long time (at least i do so). If Joe is one of those guys thinking about “i want Gnome and only Gnome” then IMHO it’s better if he sticks with a distro that is specifically constructed around it. Jane wants Kde? imho she should choose a distro that has all its configuring and addon apps built on Qt. Juan wants something lighter? Suggest him to get a distro with Xfce or whatever.
I understand that you prefer “user choice” after/during installation, while i think it’s better to choose *before*: I dont think it’s a great idea to install 6CD of Mandrake and then say “ok let’s use fluxbox” because probably all that Drake stuff is studied for (and work better in) Kde.
AFAIK some Ubuntu tool (like the upcoming hoary update manager) are optimized for Gnome (it uses Gtk, it sticks in the panel bar etc..). Maybe you can use it on kde, maybe not (i’m not so updated about Freedesktop “integration” status) but if this is the direction Ubuntu (and some other distro too) staff chose, i agree with them.
PS When somebody asks me suggestion about distros i say “i’ve tried Ubuntu and i think it’s very good but pay attention: it’s a distro with Gnome, if you prefer Kde, then get MEPIS or something else”. Plain and simple…
I’ve never tried Libranet, maybe one day i’ll give it a try…(i must check on their site what is the story of registration and pay version)
I use Ubuntu Hoary together with KDE (there are also one or two Gnome apps I use from time to time) and am happy with it. KDE support for Ubuntu isn’t yet as good and integrated as their GNOME support but it gets better and better. People are already working on it.
Of course I could use a more KDE centric distro like Mepis or SuSE, but I prefer to help to make KDE on Ubuntu rock.
SuSE is a really good, solid distro. but it is built around kde, so i dont use it. just because i dont use it doesnt mean its bad, it means i perfer using gnome. ditto with mepis. ditto with knoppix. if a kde user says the same about ubuntu, that would be more then fine. ubuntu is pretty much as gnome-centric as you can get, to the point of aligning their release cycle with gnomes’. the problem is, thats not what you are saying.
would you say SuSE, Mepis, Linspire, Xandros, or Knoppix are elitist? talk about hypocracy, five big distros where those arrogant kde users tell gnome users to bugger off, as opposed to what? gnoppix is a bit of a joke. fedora would fall into the same category as mandrake as being desktop agnostic. actually, the only distro i can think of that is like ubuntu in the gnome arena is JDS, and even then its aimed at such a totally different market its fairly irrelivent in this conversation.
the reviewer gave a gnome centric distro a bad review because it didnt have kde. im sorry, no matter which way you cut it that is retarded, not reasonable. its like slamming damn small linux for not having OO.o, or freaking out because linux from scratch has a difficult install process. that would be moronic. as is this.
i forgot to mention, ubuntu updates are debian updates. the ubuntu devs are just debian guys getting paid now. biggest difference is we ubuntu users get the fixes about six months before the rest of the debian world.
please stop trolling the ubuntu comments.
Libranet has some nice tools (as does Xandros too), e.g. the kernel compilation tools, the default firewall. However as Libranet tries to include every DE, WM and other things plus the kitchen sink (or two), it may feel a bit bloated. Many other distributions these days suffer from the same problem more or less (Mandrake, SUSE,…). And that is where Ubuntu has taken an opposite approach that suits many (especially experienced) Linux users fine.
People who complain that Ubuntu doesn’t have this or that software (like QT/KDE apps) fail to see that Ubuntu is just what many have been hoping for: a lean and not-bloated distro for you to configure and add your fav extra apps. Ubuntu knows what it wants to do and don’t have all those kitchen sinks included in the default install. Besides, it is only a matter of few apt-get commands (or use graphical Synaptic) and maybe adding a few repos to sources list, and you may soon have as much software as you wish from the official and unofficial Debian and Ubuntu repositories. Very simple? Yes (after you first learn to do it which shouldn’t be that hard).
The default theme in Ubuntu could perhaps be improved a bit so that more people like it, whether they are into liking brown or not… IMO, the warm earth tones are ok, and make the looks have a specific Ubuntu feel and brand. But maybe it is a bit too brown to make some happy? Maybe they could make it slightly lighter and use sligthly brighter colors (yellowish, orange?).
(For some similar style but sligthly brighter theme alternatives, see for example: http://art.gnome.org/themes/metacity/581/
http://art.gnome.org/themes/gtk2/594/
http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=19527
Just my 2 c…)
However, installing new themes and changing the theme in GNOME is quite easy. Nobody should make a big deal about some default theme – as such matters usually have much more to do with personal taste than with some obvious disadvantages or advantages.
Guys, Guys (I assume you both are guys anyway! :-))
Any distro extant can have whatever environment you want. Take a look at the Universe repository, and there is blackbox, XFCE, aewm, Afterstep, and 20 other desktops. Suse, which is installing on my laptop as we speak, offers BOTH the full KDE and Gnome envrions: just klick “all kde’ or “all gnome” and away you go.
That’s the beausty of linux: you can use it how you want to, using whatever interface makes you happy. I don’t see the reason for some giant flamewar about Gnome or KDE centric distros: pick which one is good for you, and run with it.
Now, I am aware that some distros prefer one DE over another, so its all about how much tweaking you want to do. Some do KDE better, some do Gnome better. *shrugs* It’s not like there isn’t enough linux choices out there.
AFAIK, all the KDE files are there, go ahead an install them via synaptic, add KDE as a session, and away you go. If you don’t want to bother(and frankly, in this day and age, why should you?), I’d suggest Zen, which has a KDE version. Very, very nice: debian woody based, live cd, easy install, stripped and clean.
But sniping at each other over GNOME v. KDE is just silly. Frankly, I want BOTH. Give me KDE apps in GNOME (like amarok), and GNOME apps in KDE (like gnucash, gnumeric). Luckily, its all just an apt-get away.
Zen, which has a KDE version. Very, very nice: debian woody based, live cd,
Correct me if I’m wrong but I think Zen Linux is based on Debian Unstable/Sid?
http://www.zenlinux.org/
Yeah, you are right…I forgot what it was tagged to.
On a second thought, most PC users probably never change the default theme of their desktop OS/DE, some don’t even know that is possible (really, most PC users are not like average OS News readers…), and in companies such personal configuration might be discouraged too. So I suppose that paying attention to the default theme in distros does make some sense.
But it’s another thing whether the default Ubuntu (or Mandrake, or SUSE, or Redahta etc.) theme suits your personal tastes or not. For example, personally I think that the Ubuntu theme is rather ok, though I would replace it with something else. But – on the other hand – while many people adore the SUSE themes, I’ve always kinda hated the slimy green SUSE lizard popping its head everywhere on the SUSE desktop… SUSE theme also used to be very green, so if green was not among your fav color, you were out of luck… Just matters of taste, of course…
Having an Ubuntu feel/brand also in the themes is very good idea IMHO. Anyway I think that Ubuntu (and GNOME) could still indeed put a little more effort to refine the default themes and looks a bit more. Maybe a bit brighter hues of those Ubuntu earth tones etc? Better icons, like some compeletely new Ubuntu (SVG) icon style, might also improve the look and feel a lot
(a personal example, my own recent fav GNOME icon theme “BlankON” by zeus http://zeus.qballcow.nl/?p=12).
Quote: “That is the worst thing I’ve ever read.. What a waste of time.”
He didn’t like it, get it? It’s his review and his opinion. If you don’t like it tough luck, he’s entitled to his viewpoint/opinion.
No it was a waste of time because it didn’t say anything. Didn’t have any usuable content .. and was just the same stupid review that you always read. There was no worth while information provided and it was boring. You could :%s/Ubuntu/’Any other Distro Review’/g out there and it would read exactly the same way and mean exactly the same thing. Which is nothing..
Well, I used Libranet for a long time and loved it. I was a KDE user for years and somehow got hooked on Gnome a couple years ago. I also like and respect the MadPenguin website.
But this Ubuntu review had a certain sour note. It was sort of like the popularity of Ubuntu was troubling the reviewer. This is sad because I get a very positive and uplifting feeling from the Ubuntu project – it embodies the true linux spirit for me.
While I am now a committed Slackware user running Gnome, I always install both KDE and Gnome. I love Quanta, K3b, and am addicted to the KDE ShisenSho game – all KDE apps that I run daily in my current Dropline Gnome. So the reviewer does have a valid point there – I would miss those slick KDE apps if I was Gnome only.
But, Ubuntu has captured my heart for my iBook. It is a dream on my little PPC G3 laptop that I use around the house for just surfing and email. Another VERY STRONG PLUS for Ubuntu is the rich and helpful resources that have just exploded in the past few months. The Ubuntu Wiki and the Unofficial Ubunto Guide (www.ubuntuguide.org) have been a great help for me.
The Ubuntu project also has that magical ingredient – big money behind it. So it ends up being free to us in the community. I pay for my Slackware, but am very happy to have a free high quality distro for my iBook.
Quote: “would you say SuSE, Mepis, Linspire, Xandros, or Knoppix are elitist?”
Matt – you are not understand or comprehending my comments. I am not saying that a single Desktop Environment based disto is good! I am saying it’s bad. Whether it’s Gnome or KDE I don’t think it’s good. So i’m not being biaised to KDE thank you. Try not to put those words into my mouth when I never said them OK?
I don’t use Suse, Mepis, Linspire or Xandros. I’ve only very rarely used Knoppix. I’m no fan of Suse for a variety of reasons. Linspire does not inspire me. Xandros is heavily broken as far as i’m concerned and with proprietary shit in it i’m not touching it. Knoppix is more a rescue/demo tool. Nothing more and nothing less.
I said the same thing a long time ago when Redhat came up with bluecurve crap. Keep kde and gnome on as a choice, let the user choose, don’t dictate. Imagine how many more potential users Ubuntu may have attracted if it offered the choice between desktop environments.
Dave
Quote: “However as Libranet tries to include every DE”
You don’t have to install them at install time. Do you? You can choose not to install Gnome, or kde etc. It’s your choice. That’s the important thing, Libranet has given you that choice. What you choose is up to you.
Dave
Actually Ubuntu is quite Debian compatible. For instance, it’s possible to install Debian’s base system with the new Sarge installer, then change the entries in sources.list to point to Ubuntu’s (either Warty or Hoary) repos, and then run “apt-get update” and “apt-get dist-upgrade”. This will leave you with Ubuntu’s base system — without gnome. Then you can install kde or xfce or whatever you wish as your Graphical User Interface for Ubuntu instead of gnome. Of course, this is not recommended for n00bs, but it’s doable.
You don’t have to install them at install time. Do you? You can choose not to install Gnome, or kde etc. It’s your choice. That’s the important thing, Libranet has given you that choice. What you choose is up to you.
Yeah, well, you’re right, of course. And Libranet has always been one of my fav distros too. Though, I’m not sure but I think that Libranet always installs at least its tweaked IceWM version too (but that can actually be a good thing in case you bork your KDE/GNOME etc. installation, you have at least some working WM then…).
Anyway, my point was that Ubuntu has decided to concentrate on GNOME mainly (not provide all DEs and WMs), and the way they implement and develop their GNOME distro is superb too IMHO (tweaked & very bleeding edge GNOME – although Ubuntu could perhaps get some more config tools besides of the basic GNOME tools). If you like GNOME, Ubuntu is THE distro to try. That is the good thing about having a clear focus.
(As another off-topic note: I finally actually installed the BlankOn icon theme that I happened to praise above (previously I had only been admiring the screenshot of that very new theme) Oh well, maybe it was not that impresive after all like it first looked… =) But anyway the author zeus sure knows how to make good and professional looking themes like his Gartoon, QNX etc. themes prove.)
it seems like you really missed the point.
ubuntu isnt about dictation or whatever misunderstanding you would insert here, its about shipping a distro that comes in ONE PIECE.
and while im working with ubuntu since its first release i have to apllause the devs, cause they did some great work. they give you a toolset for doing your work.
so what do you want?
a toe of the dev who maintains x.org? or… ?
Quote: “it seems like you really missed the point. ”
Umm no, I don’t think I missed the point. I stated my viewpoint quite nicely thanks. Others seem to have comprehended my viewpoint without too many problems.
Dave
I haven’t tried DPMS as a culprit but I have found a lot of crap dealing with fonts. I don’t really know what the issue is but it led me back to Arch. Unfortunately the 0.7 iso on arch has a balked grub installation so I went from my old copy through updates to current running dbus, hal, and hotplug. I must admit though, some of the documentation was lacking and it took a bit of scrounging to get it all running and also rhythmbox doesn’t like using OSS compatability but ALSA is fine but then osssink tests fine and runs fine with totem. Go figure.
One day I will get off my ass, have a good look and then write some instructions on how to deal with setting up dbus properly in easy and straightforward English with good documented samples explaining their effect.
Documentation is abstract at best and it is a combo of forum trawling and wiki searching that has my system up and running. Would love, as I imagine many, an easier way.
Still, best of luck Ubuntu guys and keep it coming as I was very impressed with the default install and how easy it was.
according to https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/Kubuntu it looks like Ubuntu devs are going to prepare a dual version of Ubuntu. So it seems they want to offer both choices (like you’d like) but separating Ubuntu e Kubuntu in two distros (like i prefer)