Apple has quietly cut prices on build-to-order (BTO) components for its new Mac mini. The company is now offering the Bluetooth and AirPort Extreme wireless option for US$99 (was $129), the 1GB DDR333 SDRAM upgrade for $325 (was $475), and the 80GB ultra ATA hard drive upgrade for $50 (was $80). Apple is also now listing an 8x SuperDrive option instead of the previous 4x model for the same $100 cost. Elsewhere, a Mac user reviews the iPod Shuffle ($149) vs the Sandisk MP3 player ($138, $118 with rebate), both with 1 GB of Flash memory and similar pricing but with different feature-set.
Apple Drops BTO Mac Mini Prices; iPod Shuffle Vs SanDisk Player
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ACC itself has no lock in – the OSS FACC2 libraries allow playback of ACC in Mac OSX, linux, and in windows under MoreAMP, there is also an XMMS plug-in being worked on. So really you’re only complaint is the content on the iTMS which you don’t HAVE to buy.
I don’t see why not being able to use content you purchase on “any piece of hardware” you want is such an issue for you. Its almost like seeing someone get mad when you can’t play the window’s game you bought on linux or a PS2 game in a GameCube? Are dynamix, sierra, valve, square, sony, sega, konami, etc trying to lock you in and take away your rights? (Or even worse, actually expect for you to buy a copy for your PS2 AND a copy for your Gamecube!)
The iTMS releases content for iTunes and the iPod. The record labels release content for CD players and Cassette players – you don’t see 8-Track fans getting pissed that CDs won’t play in their 8-Track do you? While WMA, MP3 etc might have more manufacturers making players and more music stores out – you are no less locked into their drm format. You can’t magically move to another format if players stopped supporting your format and computer software moved on the Next Big Codec.
As for thinking MP3 doesn’t have DRM – ACC doesn’t have DRM either. Fairplay is added to an ACC file, you could do the same for MP3 if music stores were so inclined. However MP3 is old – bit for bit its not as good of an encoding scheme as ACC, WMA, or MPEG+. Face it MP3’s time has passed in the audio quality department and DRM can be applied to any format a music store wants. You’re going to get DRM, that is not going to change. Its just a matter of finding a DRM system that is palatable for you – and you’ve yet to give any apple specific fault as to why its worse than any other DRM. (In apple you have to authorize a computer, on wma you have to back-up/maintain all your wma licenses.)
Note: I didn’t check this for typos, sorry.
PantherPPC
No, I know that ripping from a CD to a lossy codec will give you results very similar to rippring from nonDRM AAC to the same lossy codec. Burning to a CD isn’t the only option to strip DRM, and iTMS files weren’t ripped from CDs, they were compressed from masters. They made a big deal about that when they opened the store.
Ok, can you tell me specifically, step-by-step, how to get DRM AAC files to mp3, wma, or ogg without losing audio quality?
modman
you think that having an already set up playlist of all your favorite songs and then having iTunes randomly pick from that playlist to fill up the Shuffle is slower than you moving through your file system from one folder to the next…
Thing is, I don’t want the something randomly copying songs to my mp3 player. Ok, maybe every once in a great while, but I could do that without iTunes.
some times dropping down 2 levels at a time and then reversing 2 levels to get to the next group… just to pick a few songs from each folder?
As stated before, Directory Opus (the mother of all file managers) has a ‘flat file view’, whereby I can make files in several folders display as if they were all in a single folder.
Vincent
ACC itself has no lock in – the OSS FACC2 libraries allow playback of ACC in Mac OSX, linux, and in windows under MoreAMP, there is also an XMMS plug-in being worked on. So really you’re only complaint is the content on the iTMS which you don’t HAVE to buy.
My complaint about AAC (either encrypted or not) is that AFAIK, the only portable devices it works on are iPods. Whenever that changes and it becomes more mainstream, I won’t have a problem with it.
I don’t see why not being able to use content you purchase on “any piece of hardware” you want is such an issue for you.
Read: because I don’t want to pay for an overpriced HD-based iPods and the flash one is underwhelming. Give me other options besides iPods and I might have a change of heart.
Its almost like seeing someone get mad when you can’t play the window’s game you bought on linux or a PS2 game in a GameCube? Are dynamix, sierra, valve, square, sony, sega, konami, etc trying to lock you in and take away your rights? (Or even worse, actually expect for you to buy a copy for your PS2 AND a copy for your Gamecube!)
When I buy a tune, I’m expecting to keep it forever, so I want to end up with something that’s going to work 10 years from now. If I buy a PS2 game, that’s good for maybe 6 months tops.
The iTMS releases content for iTunes and the iPod. The record labels release content for CD players and Cassette players
With CDs and cassettes – you don’t see 8-Track fans getting pissed that CDs won’t play in their 8-Track do you?
With CDs, you can rip tunes and play them on whatever you want. With ITMS AAC files, you’re playing them on iPods only, or else you’re losing audio quality.
While WMA, MP3 etc might have more manufacturers making players and more music stores out – you are no less locked into their drm format.
WMA, yes .. and I don’t use it for that reason. What kind of DRM do mp3 files have?
You can’t magically move to another format if players stopped supporting your format and computer software moved on the Next Big Codec.
The nice thing about moving to the Next Big Codec is that mp3 support can always be added to any device, unlike Fairplay, which is controlled by Apple. Hence, no iPod, no Fairplay without audio quality loss.
As for thinking MP3 doesn’t have DRM – ACC doesn’t have DRM either.
Right, but since it only works on iPods (vs portable devices), what good is it?
Fairplay is added to an ACC file, you could do the same for MP3 if music stores were so inclined.
Well, if you could theoretically strip DRM out of an mp3 file like you can AAC, mp3 still has the advantage because it’s basically universal.
However MP3 is old – bit for bit its not as good of an encoding scheme as ACC, WMA, or MPEG+. Face it MP3’s time has passed in the audio quality department and DRM can be applied to any format a music store wants.
Look, I don’t have a problem with DRM. I DO have a problem with DRM that locks me in to a certain device, or that depends on me having an online connection and a server on the other end in order to authenticate. This is different than Windows XP, cuz in a few years, I’ll be done with XP. What about my music? Is it going to still work 20 years from now? If I’m going to spend several hundred bucks on tunes (and I probably would), I want that assurance. You guys think DRM owners are just going to hand you the keys to unlock everything once that part of their business goes belly-up … I say you’re incredibly niave.
Its just a matter of finding a DRM system that is palatable for you – and you’ve yet to give any apple specific fault as to why its worse than any other DRM. (In apple you have to authorize a computer, on wma you have to back-up/maintain all your wma licenses.)
Well, I see WMA as being the lesser of two evils, simply because it works on a wide variety of devices. Personally, I don’t buy into either format.
“I am sure people will be like, “How do I know what song I am listening too?” Thats what the headphones are for.”
Classic. I love it!
“Ok, can you tell me specifically, step-by-step, how to get DRM AAC files to mp3, wma, or ogg without losing audio quality?”
Okay. Import the DRM AAC into iMovie and export as MP3 at either 192 or 160 kbps. You’ve just stripped that DRM and you won’t be able to tell the difference in sound.
“Thing is, I don’t want the something randomly copying songs to my mp3 player. Ok, maybe every once in a great while, but I could do that without iTunes.”
Thing is, it’s still just an option. Research, research, research.
“As stated before, Directory Opus (the mother of all file managers) has a ‘flat file view’, whereby I can make files in several folders display as if they were all in a single folder.”
Basically labeling and sorting. Kind of like how iTunes does it. Of course iTunes uses tags instead of labels (the appropriate method for audio).
“My complaint about AAC (either encrypted or not) is that AFAIK, the only portable devices it works on are iPods. Whenever that changes and it becomes more mainstream, I won’t have a problem with it.”
Once again, it’s just an option.
“Read: because I don’t want to pay for an overpriced HD-based iPods and the flash one is underwhelming. Give me other options besides iPods and I might have a change of heart.”
So buy another player. You’re still going to have to use DRM. Just how many players do you want anyway? I buy music that plays on my player. I’ve only got the one. And it’s not like iPods are going to suddenly disappear.
“When I buy a tune, I’m expecting to keep it forever, so I want to end up with something that’s going to work 10 years from now. If I buy a PS2 game, that’s good for maybe 6 months tops.”
So burn a CD. And since when does Sony come out with a new PS every 6 months? And they’ve yet to release one that’s not compatible with older games.
“With CDs, you can rip tunes and play them on whatever you want. With ITMS AAC files, you’re playing them on iPods only, or else you’re losing audio quality.”
You’re starting with 128 kbps AAC, not exactly an audiophiles dream. That’s why they only cost a dollar. You keep changing your excuse for arguing. Make up your mind.
” WMA, yes .. and I don’t use it for that reason. What kind of DRM do mp3 files have?”
Mp3s can have DRM attached just like any mpeg based file. It’s just an outdated format so nobody sells them.
“The nice thing about moving to the Next Big Codec is that mp3 support can always be added to any device, unlike Fairplay, which is controlled by Apple. Hence, no iPod, no Fairplay without audio quality loss.”
Mp3 support won’t be added to things in a few years. They will move up to AAC, especially since it’s the format the upcoming DVD standard is based on (both proposed standards are based on Mpeg4). And you don’t lose quality. Why don’t you try it instead of complaining about something you don’t know much about.
“Right, but since it only works on iPods (vs portable devices), what good is it?”
Convert it.
“Well, if you could theoretically strip DRM out of an mp3 file like you can AAC, mp3 still has the advantage because it’s basically universal.”
Once again…Convert it. You sure are stubborn.
“Look, I don’t have a problem with DRM. I DO have a problem with DRM that locks me in to a certain device, or that depends on me having an online connection and a server on the other end in order to authenticate. This is different than Windows XP, cuz in a few years, I’ll be done with XP. What about my music? Is it going to still work 20 years from now? If I’m going to spend several hundred bucks on tunes (and I probably would), I want that assurance. You guys think DRM owners are just going to hand you the keys to unlock everything once that part of their business goes belly-up … I say you’re incredibly niave.”
They’d have to. Or else there would be a huge class action lawsuit that ended with them unlocking it anyway.
“Well, I see WMA as being the lesser of two evils, simply because it works on a wide variety of devices. Personally, I don’t buy into either format.”
Hmm. Funny, I don’t have anything it works on. It’s not about what all it plays on, it’s about what your player plays.
You really should think these things through a bit more. You are complaining about scenarios in which you don’t consider all the options. If you don’t consider the working solution, of course the scenario will fail. It’s like me complaining that I live too far away from work without considering that I own a car. Yeah, that 17 miles to work would really suck if I couldn’t drive there.
Your entire argument revolves around saying that you can convert an AAC file to mp3 without audio quality loss, but this is impossible to do, whether you’re burning a CD or using iMovie. However, how much this matters is a matter of personal opinion. Since it appears that you can’t tell a difference (which means you’ve gotta be working with some really shitty speakers, or be pretty close to deaf), it matters to me more than you. I can hear the difference between an AAC file and an mp3 file converted from it (ripped at 192kbps stereo).
If it turns out that AAC takes off like you say it will (on portable devices, not DVD players), then I don’t have much of a problem with it. But until then, it’s an iPod-only solution as far as I’m concerned.
“Your entire argument revolves around saying that you can convert an AAC file to mp3 without audio quality loss, but this is impossible to do, whether you’re burning a CD or using iMovie. However, how much this matters is a matter of personal opinion. Since it appears that you can’t tell a difference (which means you’ve gotta be working with some really shitty speakers, or be pretty close to deaf), it matters to me more than you. I can hear the difference between an AAC file and an mp3 file converted from it (ripped at 192kbps stereo).”
No, not without quality loss, without noticable quality loss if you are converting from a song purchased off iTMS. The main point there being if you are that interested in audio quality then buying compressed music is not the way to go.
“If it turns out that AAC takes off like you say it will (on portable devices, not DVD players), then I don’t have much of a problem with it. But until then, it’s an iPod-only solution as far as I’m concerned.”
It’s already confirmed that mp4 is the basis of the next DVD standard, I only assume it will replace mp3 in the long run (that was it’s original purpose). AAC is basically the audio layer of an mp4, just as mp3 (mpeg1 layer 3) is the audio layer of an mp1 (mp2 being the current DVD format, there is no mpeg3).
“Your entire argument revolves around saying that you can convert an AAC file to mp3 without audio quality loss, but this is impossible to do, whether you’re burning a CD or using iMovie. However, how much this matters is a matter of personal opinion. Since it appears that you can’t tell a difference (which means you’ve gotta be working with some really shitty speakers, or be pretty close to deaf), it matters to me more than you. I can hear the difference between an AAC file and an mp3 file converted from it (ripped at 192kbps stereo).”
If your such an audiophile then why mess with MP3s to begin with?
“If it turns out that AAC takes off like you say it will (on portable devices, not DVD players), then I don’t have much of a problem with it. But until then, it’s an iPod-only solution as far as I’m concerned.”
Among people who pay for their downloads it already has taken off.
” NewType (IP: —.ign.com) – Posted on 2005-01-25 21:47:20
“I agree, the SanDisk is a much better deal overall. Not only cheaper, but way too many features.
”
Does SanDisk have Autofill that automatically fills itself with a selection of music every time you connect it your computer?”
WMP 10 and XP can do that.
“Can it do smart Playlists?”
WMP 10 can do that too.
“Does SanDisk automatically downsample your music that’s recorded in Apple Lossless or WAV on your main system to a lower quality, compressed file format so you can fit a decent amount of music, like the Shuffle does, all automatically, without having to maintin a high-quality copy and a low-quality copy?”
WMP 9 and 10 will do that and have done so for years. In fact you can easily set WMP up to transcode media on the fly to virtually any device it recognizes including flash cards, removable hard drives, pda’s, mp3 players, network shares etc.
I have the Creative Labs MuVo TX FM. I have also owned the original MuVo w/out a screen.
The features on this player are increadable: USB 2.0 transfer, voice & FM radio recorder (very nice) – w/ it I can record a cgroup conversation w/ great qualitiy even w/ it in my pocket. It plays FM radio, has shuffle mode, linear mode, graphic equalizer & all for $100 USD. I have used it for jogging, biking, driving and working and I can tell you from personal experiance the screen comes in handy when jogging. There are many songs, especially some good Led Zeppelin classics, or Floyd, that are not recognizable from audio alone, at the begining of the song. Sometimes I’m in the mood for a certain song when jogging, and I can just look at the screen and find it quickly & easily, without running into any signs, cars or what have ya. Anyone here ever eat & drive at the same time? Its a similar thing. The screen doesnt get in the way. It is a big help. I turned off the backlight so the battery lasts longer. 18 hours of battery play is increadable on 1 AAA. This little player is a great investment.
However, there is no AM, not that that is ever used anyways. It only gets a handful of stations – no external antennae – but I would rther have this machine than a Shuffle any day.