The GNOME Foundation announced the launch of the first-ever open source desktop integration bounty hunt. The aim of the contest is to recruit new developers and to more tightly integrate the various projects that make up the desktop into a more coherent, and complete user experience. The contest consists of a number of small, concrete projects, each of which has a cash bounty associated with it. Complete the hack, enter the contest, and collect a prize. Also of great interest are Nat’s slides shown at the Gnome Summit in NY showing a bright future for Gnome and the Unix/Linux desktop.
GNOME Bounty Hunt; Nat Friedman’s Summit Slides Show Future
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Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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A fair amount of money involved. This should get the ball rolling. We need more initiatives to improve oss like this!
gnome is quickly becoming the user friendly desktop of the unix-like world (minus apple).
I especially like the evolution calendar integration to the clock calendar
..is the fact that I still fail to see their “serious innovations”. Yes, Gnome and KDE are nice and it’s good to have a free alternative to costly proprietary software, but even after looking at all those slides, I fail to see innovation, all I see is replication of ideas already implemented in OS X and Windows and misc. development (Longhorn) versions of them.
all I see is replication of ideas already implemented in OS X and Windows and misc. development (Longhorn) versions of them.
Like what?
“Innovation” is a near meaningless marketing buzzword. Stability and useablity are important for a UI, “innovation” is important for boosting Microsoft’s stock value.
People expect their desktop to behave in a certain way, that has been determined by years of industry standard. It doesn’t matter who originally had the idea. It works.
In the US the vast majority of people drive using a steering wheel, gas pedal, and brake, while sitting on the front left-side of the vehicle. When was the last time Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Volkswagen challeged the automobile User Interface? Why aren’t you complaining about that?
Don’t be carried away by Microsoft buzzwords.
gnome is quickly becoming the user friendly desktop of the unix-like world (minus apple).
I think gnome is a lot more user friendly than OS X is.
@Anonymous (IP: 66.71.219.—)
I think gnome is a lot more user friendly than OS X is.
Right until someone needs to add a new program or update one. Then the nightmare starts.
That is a problem with GNU/*/Linux as a whole, not GNOME itself. In any case, on my system software updating/installation is a whole lot nicer than on any Apple or Windows PC I’ve ever used. ‘click click click click’ gets old after a while, as does dragging stuff around. I prefer ’emerge’ or ‘apt-get install’.
Right until someone needs to add a new program or update one. Then the nightmare starts.
I didn’t quite understand what you meant by that. Could you be more specific?
I like my Update systems…
Dropline installer
Nvidia installer
Swaret
The only things i need, and Nvidia updates my drivers…
Dropline my Desktop
Swaret- everything under the hood…
They are easy to use, and they update/upgrade the whole system… unlike Windows Update[ does it update my Photoshop, Office, winamp etc.?]
>> gnome is quickly becoming the user friendly desktop of the unix-like world (minus apple).
>I think gnome is a lot more user friendly than OS X is.
That depends on how look at it. I will back you up in that gnome with HIG applications is more user freindly compared to the similar functioning parts of macosx. The problem is gnome and hig apps do not cover everything that users need to do. Because of this as a whole system a mac is more user freindly than a gnome box.
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Reading that presentation looks like gnome is definitly moving in the right direction. Having evolution broken apart, integrated and hig compliant would be a big step towards having a more useable desktop.
When was the last time Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Volkswagen challeged the automobile User Interface?
When they added those damn ghastly automatic transmissions. I would really hate to see that happen to free desktops, if you take my meaning.
the Gnome foundation should set up a donation for spesific bounties that are posted. that way, the community can add money to bountied based on what they think is really needed, though it should be restricted to what the Gnome project picks for bounties to keep a strong focus.
an example is how the LDAP work is going to take a lot of time, but it carries a 250 dollar bountie. I of course pointed out that I am sure tehy price them based on the priority they want them done.
That depends on how look at it. I will back you up in that gnome with HIG applications is more user freindly compared to the similar functioning parts of macosx. The problem is gnome and hig apps do not cover everything that users need to do. Because of this as a whole system a mac is more user freindly than a gnome box.
I agree with you. But it really depends on the gnome apps in question. I don’t have an exact figure of which gnome apps are HIG complaint, but in general, I have found gnome apps very easy to use. In fact, a lot more easier than some Mac applications I’ve used. I know many people will disagree with me here.
Reading that presentation looks like gnome is definitly moving in the right direction. Having evolution broken apart, integrated and hig compliant would be a big step towards having a more useable desktop.
I completely concur. I like the fact that they have decided to abandon MS Outlook poorly designed interface, and they focusing now on adopting the HIG specifications as well as making Evolution more modular and interactable with other apps. Not to mention the fact, that I think Evolution is the best groupware I’ve used on any platform.
When was the last time Chevy, Ford, Toyota, Volkswagen challeged the automobile User Interface? Why aren’t you complaining about that?
Funny…. I work on vechiles a lot and it’s pain in ass to buy the different tools such as metic systems and etc. You can’t just share one group of same tools on Firebird and Plymouth cars, because they are different. Oh yeah, I am complaining over this too.
I think gnome is a lot more user friendly than OS X is.
Well, I have worked with both for more than a year, and I can safely say that OSX is still more user friendly.
I’ll cut & paste here a post I’ve made on Slashdot about this subject:
The downside of course is the only big Fondations (Apache, Gnome, etc) have money to spend because they get it from the industry (like Intel, IBM,…)
Small donations are the way of the future!
A fund should be set up where people can donate money that would be allocated to bounties, and they could either select on which task they want their money to be allocated to drop it in a pool of ressources that would be allocated through some kind of more or less democratic process (secure online polls/surveys?)
As far as I know this thing doesn’t exist in the open source world. Correct me if I’m wrong.
Nope.
I were almost finished with the letter I was gonna send Nat couse of this picture:
http://www.nat.org/brooklyn-gnome-summit/img14.html
When I realised that they had been bought and the picture was valid…
I thought they had been hacked
[/i]Right until someone needs to add a new program or update one. Then the nightmare starts.
[/i]
Apt-get (.deb or rpm based ), Yum, URPMI, Portage, etc…
@Anonymous (IP: —.client.comcast.net)
Apt-get (.deb or rpm based ), Yum, URPMI, Portage, etc…
1. Installing video drivers (NVIDIA in my case) on Debian/RedHat.
2. RPM GUI installer doesn’t tell which dependancies it’s missing (Red Hat); instead it closed the window and leaves it up to the user to scratch his;I was installing GAIM. Had to get to a terminal. Same with Rythmbox and countless other Gnome 2 application.
3. This is the step I go into Disk Management and delete the Linux partitions and get back to Windows XP.
Roland:
You can’t expect the system to work exactly the way that Microsoft Windows works! Even so, if you go to the NVIDIA web site and download the drivers and use their installer, it’s basically foolproof, coupled with apt-get.
Today I installed an NVIDIA driver on my newly-installed debian sid machine. Fire up synaptic, search for NVIDIA, 1 minute later, done! If I was using Red Hat (or Fedora Core) I would use apt-get and install the NVIDIA drivers off of the ATRPMS site. This part is really braindead-easy.
Ooh, you want gaim? up2date gaim! apt-get install gaim! yum install gaim! You get the latest version, and you don’t have to traverse all sorts of application-specific web pages!
apt-get install rhythmbox (both Red Hat and Debian, it comes with both)
apt-get install openoffice.org, yum install openoffice.org
apt-get install gnucash, yum install gnucash
No command line? Ooo ooo! I can do that too! Go to the Applications Menu, System Tools, Software! (On Debian, but to get to synaptic on Red Hat it’s similar) Look at the 10000+ applications just WAITING to be installed! It’s really a tool for the lazy…lazy isn’t all bad.
Manually installing RPMs, that’s so 1998.
URPMI ( MDK has a GUI for this ), YUM, Synaptic ( GUI for APT-GET ) /APT-GET, portage all handle dependencies for you. Why would anyone not use any of the above mention package/source handlers ? You’re story is full of hot air.
Like what? Really, I read this all of the time. You mean like a network-transparent, fully-integrated desktop – the direction KDE and GNOME are currently headed in?
Like what? Really
“Focus follows eye”.
( Ideia from a KDE developer
( Ideia from a KDE developer
Not from me I meant. (I’m into KDE)
the ability for the gui RPM package manager to look up dependancies in Apt or Yum or what have you. sure, you can just get the entire package from that, but some times, I find a package I want to download. the resources are there in apt and Yum, the RPM package manager should use them.
Or better still they could just confisticate the silly thing called RPMs that is responsible for the misery of Linux packages, and use apt and debian repositories for binaries; portage and gentoo repositories for source. But alas, Red Hat has an ego as big as the Universe.
Forget package managers! WHAT EVERY DISTRO NEEDS IS A STANDARD LIBRARY!!!!!!!!
How can an automatic transmission be built into a desktop? What the hell do you mean?
Forget package managers! WHAT EVERY DISTRO NEEDS IS A STANDARD LIBRARY!!!!!!!!
note: in this question of brute force vs package managers I am interpreting package managers to represent a complete package management solution eg. dpkg + apt
Because package managers are a better solution. Why install 2gigs of libraries when a package manager can install required libraries on demand.
A package manager also helps with more than library dependancies. For example a package manager lets you easily install logical groups of applications. It can also recomend other software.
A package manager also lets you easily remove software.
A package manager simplifies maintaining your software. All of the software on your system is kept up to date though a single interface. No need to check a website for newer versions, download it, then install it. No need to run a different update program for each program you installed. All you have to do is click the update all button and the package manager does it all for you.
Downloading and installing is one way to do things. A better way imho would be to distribute repository links.
eg. A user goes to a website, clicks on the install software link which adds a repository to their list. The software is downloaded and installed automatically along with its dependancies by the package manager. The package manager will then keep the software up to date the same way it handles the rest of the system.
You can do a similar thing to this today, but it is not as automated as it could be. On debain if the app you want is not included in the standard 13000 app repository you can go to apt-get.org and search for what you want. It will find you a repository. You have to manually add that repository to you list. From there installing and maintaining the app is the same “click the go button” process as it is with included software. If someone were to make the process of adding the repositories easier installing and maintaining software on linux would be a braindead activity.
WHAT EVERY DISTRO NEEDS IS A STANDARD LIBRARY
How could a project like gnome put up a standard like a “gnome librarĩes” ? Seems like it would be better on a kernel basis.
____________________________________
Debian and Gentoo have such huge egos that they can’t use the same binary packaging format as everyone else.
That is what is keeping Linux behind, no centralized guide lines, everyone does what one think is the right thing to do ( chaos ).
“Or better still they could just confisticate the silly thing called RPMs that is responsible for the misery of Linux packages, and use apt and debian repositories for binaries; portage and gentoo repositories for source. But alas, Red Hat has an ego as big as the Universe.”
Redhat is not the only ones using rpm. There is mandrake which has urpmi which is every bit as good as apt. Oh and the next one is a real killer (-;. Fedora.. which uses *gasp* APT!
No, it’s using YUM by default which is even cooler.
Hi there,
does anybody know a mirror of Nats slides? As far as I can tell his server is down right now.
cu Martin
1. Installing video drivers (NVIDIA in my case) on Debian/RedHat.
You haven’t tried SuSE. It automatically detects most video cards, and in the case of NVidia, you just need to start Online Update and select “NVidia video drivers” from the updates list.
2. RPM GUI installer doesn’t tell which dependancies it’s missing (Red Hat); instead it closed the window and leaves it up to the user to scratch his;I was installing GAIM. Had to get to a terminal. Same with Rythmbox and countless other Gnome 2 application.
You haven’t tried SuSE. If you click any RPM from the file manager (Konqueror) on SuSE, an embedded package installation window appears, from where you can launch YaST to install it. Yast will then automatically solve any dependencies.
3. This is the step I go into Disk Management and delete the Linux partitions and get back to Windows XP.
I would NEVER do that. And you know why? The fonts in XP look horrible. I have turned on ClearType, which is recommended for LCD displays (I have one), but for some reason it just looks like ClearType blurs the fonts and makes vertical bars green.
FreeType does these things correctly, I can at least configure it so that it knows my screen has vertical instead of horizontal divided pixels. Yes, on FreeBSD my fonts look great. After a week with Windows XP, I am so happy I found out how to install the BSD bootloader!
hah, his user experience is almost identical to mine, except I tried SuSE. I used Yast to install the latest nvidia drivers, the next time I booted Suse locked up on the login screen (i mean like a HARD lockup, the mouse didn’t move). Couldn’t do anything. Device Manager -> Delete partition.
they have very cool stuff but when downloaded where do we go from there?
I once installed Mandrake and went to KDE-LOOK.ORG to install themes and stuff. It was frustrating because I downloaded stuff and nothing was getting installed with success.
We can’t even do the trivial stuff? I had more success with Gnome (Red Hat) but it used to crash a lot.
http://sourcesupport.org/
http://www.linuxfund.org/
Ok, they’re available again now.
cu Martin
“That is what is keeping Linux behind, no centralized guide lines, everyone does what one think is the right thing to do ( chaos ).”
There are various centralized guide lines. Standards, organisations. However when there’s too much of such, choice says ”byebye”. Diversity (what you call ”chaos”) has both Good and Bad sides.
People learn from the Bad sides, really. Why do you think, Freedesktop.org exists?
On the system like Slackware-9.x, I never see even one time Gnome crashed. Gnome whether rock or not depends on who rebuild gnome for a specific distro. On RedHat, mainly goes with Gnome long time, however it is still crashed sometimes.
About update,
make it easy with:
#dropline-installer
#swaret –update && –upgrade -a
#nvidia-installer –update
Then You have a cutting-edge OS, very rock, simply fast and cute to use.
Just for Slackware(r)s and Slacker(s) only 🙂
//End
If the thing was designed properly, there wouldn’t be much of an issue.
Most of a ‘desktop environment’ important details are underneath, not the pretty GUI. ( though the importance of having a CONSISTANT GUI shouldn’t be dismissed. )
They should have had mechanisms in place from DAY ONE for shared information and intercommunications.. not something that was seemingly tacked-on later.. Integration of the desktop must be done on the fonctionnality level, not on the software level.
KDE is much closer to this, as they PLANNED ahead, and didn’t just wing-it since it was ‘pretty’. See http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/view/232 for example.
The problem with GNOME is that they use GTK+ object-oriented style, but don’t borrow the most important aspect of (early, anyhow) GTK… cleanliness and simplicity! Without that, the GTK-inspired GNOME macro, er object, system is COMPLETELY INCOHERENT and to put it completely blunt: SHIT.
Not to mention the fact that the numerous API libraries do not work well together and stability will _never_ be achieved since one package will _always_ depend on something that is considered beta or unstable.
Don’t even get me started on the various ad-hoc configuration mechanisms and the nightmare that is CORBA and Bonobo.
Sorry to sound harsh, but it was a complaint of mine from day one of GNOME, it just wasn’t professional.. They worried more about a stupid foot in the menu then making it solid and consistent.. Now they are finding out the price to be paid if they want to stick around and be more then a cute plaything…
But I’m not really sure what to think of it, honestly. That they’d have to involve money to have things that SHOULD be simple get done.