Before I get started on my views, I would like to point a few things out. I’m not in high school or college. I’m 35 years old and have been in the computer business a long time. My experience goes all the way back to the hey days of punch cards. I still have a few cards over at my folk’s house. I think one of the ‘programs’ prints out a snoopy. I’ve worked for several large corporations including IBM and GTE. I’m bringing this up not to brag but to point out that I know a thing or two about computers. Now that that’s out of the way, I’ll continue.Editorial Notice: All opinions are those of the author and not necessarily those of osnews.com
Like any techie I do my best to keep up with all the latest news on the web. Slashdot, Wired, CNET, OSNews, etc.; I visit them all just about everyday. And frankly as time goes on, the same theme is happening on most of the tech forums: ‘Let’s all jump on the bash Microsoft wagon.’ It’s getting old, just like when everyone was on the bash IBM wagon. Is it just me or is there some kind of book or website that the bashers all read from? It just seems that no matter what tech forum I go into, the same things are brought up every time.
Let me show a few examples:
1. Microsoft sucks or M$ sucks ? ok, and?
2. Microsoft is bundling or buying everything to stifle competition.
3. And the opposite, Microsoft isn’t adding enough features to IE, Windows, etc.
4. Windows has so many security leaks, it’s not funny. I bet Linux has few too but of course, not as many.
5. Windows crashes all the time.
I get a kick of that out last one. It’s funny that all the Window PCs I’ve worked on always seem to work pretty well. Of course, I’m very proactive on making sure everything is up to date and configured correctly. And with the release of Windows XP, unless I’m doing something I shouldn’t be, it just doesn’t crash, not at all. I could go on but you’ve all seen the same things I have. I’m telling you that there has to be a website where you can copy and paste these messages into the forums. That way you don’t have to think about it anymore. If there isn’t one, I’m going to create it.
The point is, it’s getting old, get over it, move on, and get a life already. Yes, there are some things that suck about Windows but then again there are some things that suck about Linux. But if you’ve been in the IT field for any reasonable length of time you will find out one simple fact, each OS has its place in a network.
Right now, like it or not, Windows is the dominate DOS (Desktop Operating System) and will be for some time. The truth is, Linux just doesn’t have the install/uninstall abilities that Windows does. And I’m sorry but re-compiling the kernel for what ever reason just doesn’t make it. We don’t even need to mention the fact that most users in a call center are much more familiar with Windows which makes it easier to train them. Do we even bother getting into the issue of driver support for Linux which doesn?t match Windows? I would like to see Linux come up and match Windows app for app and feature for feature but that isn’t happening yet. Give a few more years and that may not be the case. But then again a lot of the people in the Linux camp keep forgetting one thing, Microsoft isn’t just going to sit around and do nothing. Linux is going to have to make some big strides in a short amount of time to compete on the desktop and I hope the Linux crowd can do it. I would like to see the day when I can go to BestBuy and see just as many games and application titles for Linux as I do for Windows. It would be nice change of pace.
In a LAN environments, I would prefer to run Novell Edirectory for handling users. Edirectory is easy to manage and is cross platform. You can run it on Aix, Linux, Windows, Novell, and Solaris. Neither Microsoft nor any of the Linux distros can handle users better than Edirectory. I would even go so far as say that I would prefer to run Novell for my NOS (Network Operating System) over Microsoft and Linux to handle users, software distribution, etc. While working at GTE, we had several Novell 4.11 servers that would run for over 400 days at a time without a crash. Sometimes, I would just go and finally reboot them just so I’d feel better. And if Novell had a decent DOS, I’d probably run that too. But that?s just me. Linux does a much better job of handling web and email services than either Microsoft or Novell. Microsoft on the other hand, in my opinion, is a great application NOS.
In this day and age, IT departments need to get away from running a single OS to handle all of their needs. They should use the best OS for what ever the situation calls for. If in some cases, you need to run Linux on the desktop rather then Windows, then do it. It just makes sense. Yes, this can get expensive but the benefits far out weight the costs. And when things are running good, I can spend more time coming up with new ways to spend the company’s money, when they allow me to that is.
About the Author:
35 years old, I’ve working in the computer field for over 15 years for various companies including IBM, GTE, and Alltel. I also ran my own small consulting/programming business for a few years. I currently live in Parma Ohio, just south of Cleveland.
microsoft bashing happens because:
1) people have been burnt by their products (e.g. crashes, bugs, security problems, poor design)
2) people have been burnt by their marketing (new microsoft product, with new innovation(tm), solves poverty, hunger, promotes world peace)
3) people have been pissed off by the way they treat the personal computer market as their own fiefdom (e.g. file format lockin, death of netscape, media player wars)
4) people don’t like their attitude (halloween documents, bill gates lying on the stand, steve ballmer’s ‘i love this company’)
5) people don’t like that they have a near-monopoly position in the client operating systems and office software market and are using that to try and open up other markets through sheer force of money
6) it’s hard to have sympathy for microsoft when they are so rich and pampered and focussed yet time and again have delivered software that other people have done better for less money, but because they’re microsoft, they win by default
until these are all fixed, the microsoft bashing will continue…
I agree with this article.
Right now im on my newly-installed version of Mandrake 9.1. It is the best linux I have ever used. I still hate the RPM way of installing packages.
OSX has the best Application installation method out there period. Decompress an archive and move the application file to the application folder, or if it is a low level thing, run a package installer.
To remove an OSX application, just trash the application file. End of story.
Linux still isnt clean and consistent. You cant beat price or the thousands of applications that run it. You also need to be a CS Enthusiast to use it. IT is getting a hell of a lot better.
XP is fairly nice. I use it a lot. It gets slow and bogged down. Mandrake runs circles around it.
XP almost never crashes. Ive had X wig out on me in mandrake once or twice, but I did was fooling around with the new nvidia drivers and watching dvds with mplayer.
OSX has the best of both worlds, at the expense of proprietary hardware. I will use an OSX Laptop and a generic intel box running linux and xp. I have to use all 3.
OSX is the best user experience with the most polished apps.
The unix base underneath is amazing, if a little dated.
Fink (apt-get) and hardware accelerated x11 are great too.
Linux is making a mad, energetic push to surpass osx. They have a long way to go but have came really far in a short time. 3 years ago linux was a bitch to use. Now its so much better. Keep up the good work guys!
XP, i dont know where thats going to go. It cant get any better and i am very leery of drm
.. for someone to publicly address this. I know OSNews and Eugenia take a lot of flak for not being bias towards Linux but I just want to say that there are people out there that enjoy reading non Linux-centric technical news. Thank you, OSNews for making free speech possible.
Thanks for addressing real issues.
Okay, how about the DirectShow architecture as compared to… gstreamer? DirectShow is a robust and mature graph-based streaming media architecture supporting virtually every video and audio codec in existance. Furthermore, it’s included per default on every Windows Windows machine. gstreamer is a relatively immature codebase which copies the design of DirectShow, has significantly reduced support for container formats/codecs, and does not come per default with any Linux distribution that I know of. It certainly isn’t standard across all systems.
I’m not super familiar with multimedia stuff, but it strikes me that http://doc.trolltech.com/3.1/netscape-plugin.html supports pretty much everything at the API level. Since you can then plug to any app…
How about… GDI versus X? GDI requires only a single context switch for something like pressing a pushbutton… whereas X requires more than 10. GDI provides all the features of X including transparency,
GDI does not support transparency meaningfully. That’s the reason 8000 other solutions exist ande have existed. If GDI meaningfully supported transparency there wouldn’t be any need for Metaframe. Thin client computing would be as easy on windows as on Unix. Certainly the situation is better than it was 10 years ago with PCAnywhere being the best solution but I have yet to hear anyone in the windows world casually use dumb X Terminals (or I guess dumb GDI terminals) and have a more feature rich environment than they would if they had a thick client.
but also allows for subpixel hinted antialiased fonts in *every* application, not just applications compiled specifically to support them
That’s because they’ve all been compiled to support them i.e. they use Windows for many more GUI features than X apps did. Windows is a GUI, X is a window manager. The real comparison is GDI vs. something like QT/KDE.
(and there’s a standard architecture, no Xft/Xft2/STSF compatibility issues)
I’d say X is more standard than windows. I happen to run my windows at 133 dpi instead of 96 dpi and I notice huge problems with apps not handeling things in standard ways. With X apps I never have these kinds of problems because they don’t make the same assumptions.
In a the space of an hour we get two articles. One complains that Linux has TOO many applications and the other argues it doesn’t have enough.
for windows vs linux discussions, visit:: http://forums.anandtech.com/
<img src=”http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/home/atehrani/uptime.jpg“>
This whole thing is a joke-
Most people that bash microsft have no idea what theya re talking about “Windows sux, linux is better” Well i bet that 13 year old has never even installed a copy of linux, letalone used linux
Hell the funniest thing i ever heard was a guy say “Dos was the best operating system microsft ever produced, it never crashed.” Hell i laughed my head off, to that dumbass i issue a challenge- First one to rip this DVD to divX wins- Call me when your done dumbass
And what about this monopoly crap, most people dont know what the definition of a monopoly is, hell the whole DOJ case bought against microsoft was not “Microsoft is being charged with being a monopoly”, despite the common fools belief. If it was up to me I’d say that apple was more of a monopoly than microsoft- they control the hardware and software of the computers they make. And what about general motors, are you going to call them a monopoly because the produce more that one car brand???? I didnt think so.
Also what about those people that say “Bill gates sux” or “I hate bill gates” do those people really think that it was bill gates that wrote that peice of code in their POS bit of software, hmm lets say AOL messenger that caused windows to crash?? To those people i say- “Bill shot a 34 on the front nine, but let it slip with a 38 coming home.
Any the most important thing here is, no one is forcing you to use windows, I dont see bill gates standing there with a gun to your head saying “use windows 3.11” or “Use windows XP” If you dont like windows, go use linux, you can get your 13 year old buddies round for a pyjama party and format your computers and install linux on them-
A revolution has got to start somewhere, hell i bet the windows community wouldn’t miss ya
From A Micorsoft user; not because I have to, but because they currently produce the best software for my job.
I would never tire of bashing Microsloth. If Apple went out of business and OS X was no more, I would run Linux. If MS destroyed Linux, I would find something else but I refuse to support Microsoft – inferior products at inflated prices, and the utter stifling of innovation and competition sicken me.
jbolden1517: GDI does not support transparency meaningfully […]
Errrr, i think bascule was talking about alpha transparency (as in transparent menus, icons and stuff like that) wich xfree86 does not support, not network transparency.
Some of it is pretty hackneyed – especially “clever” variations on the word Microsoft. Do the people who use “M$” not realize that it has roughly the same effect as wearing a t-shirt with an arrow pointing upwards, right above the words “I’m with stupid”?
This does not mean, however, that Microsoft is undeserving of criticism – because they are. If for no other reason than the fact that Microsoft’s market position is certainly not a reflection of the relative quality of their software. Given the amount of money/manpower Microsoft has to spend on developing their OS, their market dominance, and the exhorbitant prices of their products, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that Windows be head and shoulders above competing products. This doesn’t necessarily imply incmpetence on the part of Microsoft; they have realized, as a friend of mine once said about psychology, that “there’s no money in cures – just in repeat customers.”
As Neal Stephenson said, (paraphrasing) “criticism of Microsoft is eerily reminiscent of the capitalism vs. communism debates of old. The Bourgeois were hated by both sides: by the proletariat, because they had all the money, and by the intelligentsia, because of their tendency to spend it on lawn ornaments.”
There are many reasons to bash Microsoft… at least in “our” minds. When I write “our” I mean people who really love computers. Whether it is a computer engineer (that’s me!), a system administrator, or just a casual user in the know, it is this passion that prompts one to complain for Microsoft’s shortcomings. Granted, one could argue that Microsoft has done a lot for computers in their reign. However it could also be argued that Microsoft has set back computing and are working and causing others to work THEIR way.
Sure Microsoft sells better software that is better then what they put out a few years ago. Does this mean that just because they release something better than a slide rule rather than dirt that they have achieved something? Ok, maybe it is a little better than a slide rule…
People argue that Linux is way behind with their redundant similar programs and their crappy installations. It may not be flashy but for the most part it works and doesn’t give you any unpleasant surprises. When you break something in Linux, it is usually YOUR fault and not that of the OS. I am glad there are many programs for Linux redundant or not. Choice allows the consumer to get the best product for their purpose.
Let’s face it; Linux is for the most part a geek OS. An OS for those who really care. How many Linux or Apple users do you know that don’t care about computers. Not many if any.
Taken from http://www.Fuckmicrosoft.com/about.shtml:
Linux fans, BSD fans, UNIX fans, Apple fans — and I’m all of the above — we all are known for our devotion, our absolute, inalienable conviction that we’re right.
No offense, but business people who just use a computer to email people are not going to have fun in recompiling their kernel. The type of people who like to use Linux are the type of people who enjoy this activity and learning all about using Linux. Once Linux is fully learned it really is a wonderful and stable OS. Yes Linux is much harder to use than Windows, but it is getting much easier. People confuse this difficulty with performance a lot, which is a grave mistake. You can do everything in Linux you can on Windows, but you might have to do some research/coding to make it possible. And yes you can do a lot of things in Windows an easier way, but you will have to sacrifice stability, security, and perhaps some money.
Why are old versions of Windows 95 still being run but nobody ever hears of an old <insert any Linux distribution here> install? Old versions of Windows are run by people who don’t care about computers… or can’t afford to. People who really care about computers are going to upgrade because they care about being up to date and want to check out the latest features.
So the point is: Windows beats Linux in some areas (even though I failed to mention these points, which side do you think I am on) and Linux beats Windows in some areas. But computer nerds are the ones who are going to be the most actively involved in this area and are going to want features that normal people wouldn’t even know about. Linux is for that crowd. Windows is for the people who wander why people bash Microsoft all the time. If you don’t know, it doesn’t matter. Continue using Windows because I personally don’t care because I know you really don’t either (it would be nice if you were enlightened though! A lot of people just aren’t going to care though). If you are a computer power user and use Windows at work, that’s certainly okay. Use whatever OS gets the job done best. I am not saying don’t use Microsoft although I wish that were truly an option for everyone. Just because Microsoft products are used does not exempt them from criticizing. I must admit though blindly bashing Microsoft all the time on every front is annoying and dare I say wrong.
Amen. I work with both as a sysadmin, and I don’t really have a problem with either. That’s not to say that I don’t prefer one or the other, though..
like I said in my last post with all the trolls I’m running 2k3 and properly configured<B/> it makes the best desktop option IMO.
I don’t remember the punch cards, but I do remember the snoopy printouts. Yes, I have been around computers as long as you have, and I find it amazing that you just don’t get it. Microsoft has always been about dominance, if Microsoft had their way, every piece of software you would run would be by Microsoft. Personally, I don’t like that idea, I run Linux. I also happen to know a heck of a lot about a computers, and I know that Unix is where it’s at. Not some GUI invented by some corporation who wants to control everything. You may start to see more games/applications in Best Buy that work for linux in the near future. Anyway, do yourself a favor and get off your Microsoft high horse, and instead of complain about how Linux lacks x feature for product n, why don’t you actually contribute something back to the community and make linux, YOUR OS, a better product.
>If you don’t like to read anti-M$ “bashing”, don’t read it.
I am sorry, but this might be sounding fair for you and some of the other readers, but it is not fair for the web site owner (let alone MS itself and its employees). Having mindless trolling on his/her web site, is something that is simply not fair. Personally, I created this web site out of love on reporting on cool things and as I have said in the past, I am a technology lover, not a politician. Therefore, I like all worth noting technologies, even if they come from MS or straight from hell. But having mindless drones bashing without thinking on my articles is NOT fair for the WORK I put into this effort. If you want to be unkind to MS, go to their site or call them on the phone and tell them that they suck and that you would like to see them yanked, I don’t care. But telling that to MY site, is just not acceptable.
Sorry Eugenia but sometimes people ranting about Windows get modded down, even when they actually have something worth to say while bashing others OSes (especially the non-commercial ones) seems acceptable. While I don’t think you do that on purpose, it’s just seems like that sometimes.
People that works on OSS don’t gain nothing from it (in financial terms), almost all of them do it as a volunteer work and let you use their work for free. Once in a while, we can see people saying that OSS developers do not listen to their users, but that’s just not true. I’m in the Gnome ICU mailing list and people there are among the finest that I ever met. Every e-mail that gets in there is carefully read and answered by the developers (especially Olivier Crete, a great guy!). Even the most bizarre features requests get very polite and informative answers.
People at Microsoft do have a company behind them to back them up. These guys don’t.
Regards,
DeadFish Man
After posting this editorial and seeing it spread to 2 other websites that I know of, I’m amazed that not only are some people not understanding the point of the op-ed but feel the need to attack me personally as well.
The point of the op-ed is simply this, use the best tool for the job. Stop bashing because of this or that, it is pointless. No, Microsoft isn’t the best tool for everything as I pointed out but then again, neither is Linux, OS/2, BEOS, AIX, etc. And I happen to really like BEOS. They all have their places, just as we want the best person for a certain job so we should expect to use the best software or hardware for the job. I am not and never been a professial writer, just a geek like many of you who surf the net and experiment with a lot of different things. I just got sick of tired the all bashing.
Remember, something is only great until something else comes along that is better, and then that becomes great.
the good news is that he is looking at an end-user’s perspective.
if he had to support 1000 windows xp desktops, and he wrote how good and wonderful the operating system was, then i’d call him a liar. but as he is *only* looking at his end-user experience, where he uses 1 or 2 applications and unable to change the time or describe to us how his it department is monitoring and managing his computer, then this is just another example of a person telling us how well his it department is at maintaining a stable windows environment.
Anonymous: what does the box do? Why was the screen shot taken in september last year? I have had linux boxes up for 400 days, but we had to move last year so its now at 230 days.
Here is how I intrepret this article by Karl Sak:
I have been spending the past thirty years learning how to use Microsoft, and I fear that this new operating system called Linux is about to take over. Therefore I will try and claim that Microsoft has it’s place just like linux has it’s place by using old arguments that do not have any merit with modern linux distributions and hopefully this will somehow prevent linux from completely taking over. This way, all of the effort I’ve spent over the past thirty years learning Microsoft wont all go to waste.
I think this is the dumbest thing I’ve read on OS News.. Infact lately i’ve been reading alot of dumb half-assed articles here so I think i’ll stop reading. With that said.. I’d like to point out that having a viewpoint on discussing such a topic as “Microsoft Bashing” means that the author has his own conceptual views/bias’s or opinions. There is nothing wrong with that so long as you give and make objective criticisms based on the fact that you are and/or will be biased with what you present. I don’t get this from the article at all not only that but; Who cares? How does this affect me and why should I care? If you’re a professional you already know about whats good and whats not to get your job done. You make your objective criticisms and jabs over at the water cooler, have a couple of chuckles and then try to figure out if you can sneak out of work 15 minutes early without being caught. Sadly, the only one promoting more bashing and more discussion on this rotten corpse of a horse is the author. OSNews is on the suck because of articles like this.
Christopher, this is the whole point:
“There is nothing wrong with that so long as you give and make objective criticisms based on the fact that you are and/or will be biased with what you present.”
The problem is that 99% of the Ms bashers are _not_ objective on their critisisms. This is unfair. And this is debunked out in the editorial.
>OSNews is on the suck because of articles like this.
OSNews raises the bar for not being yet another shitty MS-bashing site. I comment them for that.
I read that you are a FreeBSD developer btw? Possibly with your own personal bias?
I get tired of all the bashing also. Windows XP is a great product. I enjoy using it.
“simply inform of other options and allow them to choose”
Exactly! I love this concept!!
Give me the facts and let me make my decision. Don’t tell me how to think becase I don’t care what you want.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion or view.
>>>Give me the facts and let me make my decision.
Many tried that, but zealots are STILL trying to make an issue when there is none and try to distort how things really are.
You read articles, reviews and people try to be objective saying that a product of MS might be good, and then they get the helluva from the linux weenies that DO NOT accept the POSSIBILITY that something might really be good!
So, even with the facts layed out all over the place, zealots will still try to distort the reality. Hence, editorials like this one, people who can’t get anymore all this shitty behavior from Linux and Mac zealots.
This guy is so right!!! Everyone always bashes Microsoft and nobody bashes linux ever!
GMAFB! (I made that up, it has the words give, me, a, and break in it, you figure out the rest)
I have several friends who are died in the wool MS fanboys. They think it that company is the second coming or something. Most linux reviews end with something along the lines of “It’s better but I can’t see myself using it every day.” And every article about Windows XP reads like an advertisement.
Now I have had problems with linux and problems with windows. I don’t ever try to bash windows and I really don’t think most people do. Saying that you think KDE is better than Windows is not bashing MS. It is stating a preference.
As to the questions about MS bundling and buying out to stifle competition… THEY WERE FOUND GUILTY OF IT IN A COURT OF LAW. This isn’t some crackhead conspiracy theory. These are well documented practices. It doesn’t take a genius to spot them.
It’s a side day when I see someone shed a tear for Microsoft because someone talked bad about them in a forum. GTFU.
It’s extremely hard to trust this guys opinion when he doesn’t even know what DOS stands for.
You read a story about theatres using Windows Media 9 on the slashdot site, and instead of people discussing the technology it’s a non-stop stream of BSOD, reboots, ect. jokes; it does get old quick.
You expected this to get a good reception at slashdot? 95% of the people who post at /. are at least slightly ani-ms. I don’t understand why you would bother reading the discussion on an ms article if you knew that?
Windows 2000 and XP are great operating systems. I’ve only seen 5 BSOD’s since windows 2000 came out. Most were caused by bad ram. Yes operating systems have their place. For me, Windows 2k/XP are for the desktop, and FreeBSD for webservers. Linux…in the toilet. Solaris…in MS’s trashbins.
As for being a monopoly, you guys all think it sucks, but in actuality, its good! Going back to standard oil, if they didn’t create a monopoly, all the oil back then would be fragmented almost as bad as linux. No standards, no quality check, everyone competing against another, high prices (the oil was cheaper as standard oil), the oil industry was a mess! Standard oil brought all that together and made oil standard! If linux did that, it’d be able to take over microsoft maybe, but by competing with each other, it never will. Microsoft on the other hand has the monopolgy, and like standard oil, they’ve brought a standard OS to the desktop compatible with each other (mostly). In an industry with no standards, having a monopoly is a good thing because it forces a standardize environment which is good! Standards are good! Imagine every OS out there has an equal market share, look at all the potential incompability problems between operating systems! You say, each os will make a compability layer between them! Then it’d be defeating the purpose of having different operating systems! It also means creating standards, in a place where there wasnt any before. Get over it!!
Well This article wouldn’t be complete without someone bashing miro$oft so here it goes:
I congratulate this 35 year old microsoft certified employee of both GTE and IBM. Mentioning that you worked at these companies adds no value to your statements. What did you do at those companies? Did you perhaps work on Microsoft computers? Perhaps you even never touched another operating system in your life. Since you make your living fixing the bugs in Microsoft’s products, of course you want it to be the best. You will live in denial for another 35 years I’m sure. If you keep your views the same throughout your life, you will be safe from trying new things and being proven wrong.
The argument that Microsoft has made/makes good products is easily refuted with the evidence that they in the past have not. They have gaping security holes. Saying so is not a rant, it’s a fact. Look at openBSD. 1 remote hole in 7 years. Microsoft is luck when they go a week without a new security hole. Windows crashes. Windows has the blue screen of death. It’s happened so much I can say BSOD and you know what I mean. XP has the BSOD. I’ve seen it. These are facts. Live with it. If you don’t like these facts about Microsoft, explore your other options instead of hiding from them,
AlanS, what you refering to is old dos as in disk operating system. But that term really doesn’t apply any more if you consider the various OSs and platforms that are currently available. That is why I refer to DOS as desktop operating system and NOS for network operating system. And back then there wasn’t a really difference betweeen desktop pcs and server pcs like there is today. Considering that MS-dos came from qdos, you do know what that stands for correct? Here is little history lesson, you see when IBM need an operating system for the 5150 aka ibm pc, they went to dr-dos but basically got turned down. Gates was approached but didn’t have an os so he bought qdos (quick and dirty operating system) and that’s how microsoft took off. My guess is that you don’t know what cp/m stands for either. As usual, people like you don’t seem to think that I know a whole lot. But as usual people like you are clueless and no doubt feel the need to bash anything and anyone that they don’t agree with.
I happen to agree with the author.
There’s just no such thing as the “best” OS. It doesn’t exist. Each one has its place. There’s no need for OS holy wars, if anything it holds back technological advancement.
There’s a lot I don’t like about Microsoft… They’re definitely not perfect. But there’s also a lot of things to be critical about when it comes to Linux and Apple as well.
I’m tired of hearing people spew all this crap. They need to wake up and realize that nothing is perfect, and people should use whatever works for them.
I was one of those people. I hated Microsoft, I never said anything good about them. I bashed them all the time and talked about the greatness of Linux and the Mac.
But I was wrong… As I used Linux more, I became very annoyed by its limitations. And as for Apple, they’re just as bad as Microsoft. Forcing everyone to use OS X by not allowing new systems to boot OS 9 is just messed up!
As for stability… Windows NT, 2000, and XP are very stable products. Sure 95/98 sucks, but soon they’ll be history. Although while I was running Win98, I only had about one crash a week?? About as much as I was getting with Linux. KDE and Gnome crash you know…
So bascially no OS is perfect… you should use what you’re most comfortable using and what fits your needs the most.
For me politics have no place when it comes to choosing an OS. I use what works…
And currently I’m using Windows XP, Windows 2000, Windows 98, Windows 3.1, SuSE Linux 6.4, RedHat 6.2, Mandrake 9.0, OS/2 Warp 3 & 4, and FreeBSD 4.7
Each one has its place…
xan…
Well, despite using a beos lightbulb icon, which is right twisted logic there- I’m not tired of so called “bashing” ms.
IBM wised up. MS WILL NOT. Stubborn and with great malice. They do not compete. They soley destroy others, and attempt to suck everyone into their garish dark nightmare.
They are not a cute butterfly, but a vagrant moth. I know, I actually worked for them. I did not get fired, I quit working for them. I saw too many competitors get wiped off the face of the earth. I saw innovation- abandoned for marketing. I saw original ideas from others, flat out stolen, trademarked, and modified in ways to make the OS inoperable except to it’s own, and that’s not even true. .NET doesn’t even work with .NET.
You ask if I’m quite finished “bashing” microsoft. Compared to their wiping out competitors completly? I haven’t begun to fight. Whether you’re a microsoft lover that considers ANY alternative “a threat”, or a member of the alternative communities, KNOW THIS. The alternative communities, rejoice in the fact we can compete, whether it be linux, bsd, amiga de, riscos, beos, or some strange exotic OS community. We shove it up for everyone to see. To my knowledge, Apple isn’t a competetor of Microsoft, but a puppet, who acts the same way, especially with their deals with motorola. vagrance and malfacience. It’s ok, IBM’s with us- seeing that micro-soft, from the start was nothing but lies, backstabbing, huffing puffing maniacs.
I know. Now you do. That’s why you had to ask.
Dude I had a one of the models that came out not long after the 5150 (can’t remember the model number but it had an 8088 processor). If I were you I’d be careful not to think that the experiences you’ve had means that your opinion is any more valid than any other opinion, because you just come off as an arrogant twat.
lets face it, gaming on linux, its not there yet.
In selection it is pretty poor, but if you have a game with a linux version included or availabe I suggest giving it a try. I have heard of some EXTREMELY impressive results in 3d gaming in linux with the newest nVidia drivers. We are talking about massive fps in NWN as compared to a windows box. I have no idea why this is or if it is true. But people in the gentoo forums were freaking out about it.
THAT is where the genuine merits of Windows lies – things you can do in it that you can’t do with Linux. That does NOT mean that it’s a better OS – just that it has been blessed with more developers.
So you are suggesting that Windows’s only advantage is that it has the massive marketshare lead it does (hence, developers develop only for windows?). I kind decide whether I agree with that statement or not.
Until Linux is up to snuff in the audio department, I will never use it – I don’t give a damn how stable/secure/unbreakable it is.
Excellent, follow up an insightful statement with something ignorant. It keeps us on our toes.
You know as well as anyone else that it is the responsiblity of developers to port their products to different platforms. You are saying that there should be an entire set of open source apps for linux that compete with all of the commercial software released for windows? That is insane, and I think we all know it.
After reading the first page of comments.. I came to one realization.. There wasn’t as much “bashing” as I expected. The bashing I did see (well, most of it) was well founded nad half way professional in presentation. I will tell you first hand that my XP Pro machine has been up for 79 Days, 18 Hours, 21 Minutes according to the sysinfo command.
Like our thread starter friend, I remember the punch card days as well. I currently work for Parker-Hannifin Corp. in a sister office located in Pittsburg PA. At work, I use XP Pro with 16 servers running anything from VPN to File and Print services. Out of the 16: 7 run Windows 2000 Server, 3 run Advanced Server, 2 run 2k Datacenter (23 Processors each) and the other four run VMS or AS 400. We haven’t had to reboot datacenter m’frames since install. The average uptime on the 2k Advanced and below is 139 days. We usually handle anywhere from 11,000 to 15,000 connections daily.
I enjoy using linux, it has many features that just scream “mess with me”, in fact the entire OS says that. MacOS, I can’t seem to find any technical use for even with BSD included. I still think it’s useless. But, without a doubt, it has it’s place in the network.
One fact remains for all who hate good ole bill or Microsoft itself, it’s becoming the defacto standard. You can’t run into to the computer world without running into a Microsoft product. I have no doubt that they can’t be unseated as No.1, but I don’t see it as likely in the near future.
I am not tired of M$ bashing. I am tired of idiots thinking they have something important to say. Americans act like they are sooo interesting, and really well informed.
Melinda, I am really really tired…
I have heard many MS/XP fans complain that no one criticizes linux enough. Yet, even though over half the articles on this site are about linux, I would say that nearly half the posts on any of these articles are very critical about linux.
People easily confuse criticisms and jabs at the company and their policies as criticisms of the MS XP system itself and the funny thing is that is wrong. Most of the posts are MS bashing more than they are XP or 2000 bashing.
If anything this is one of the few sites out here like this that has as many if not more windows fans than linux fans in terms of OS preferences. It is funny that people out there do not see this.
Xandros kicks ass, but it’s a bit pricy
But at least Windows is cheap.
Well some people feel the need to complain when there is no need to. Windows 95 had problems, as did OS/2, Linux, and almost all OSes in their early stages. Windows was drastically changed when 95 came into effect and problems are an obvious obstacle that needs to occur to grow into a stable, viable solution. Look at what happens when the Linux kernel changes versions. 2.2 kernel to 2.4 kernel was a huge transition that caused many issues however the cycle in Linux is drastically shorter then that of MS Windows. In 3 months most 2.2 to 2.4 bugs were fixed and with an army of open source developers this is possible. However it takes a company using closed source and fewer employees an obvious longer period of time (aprox 6 – 12 months), which is how MS has been doing things for years now. NT had a new service pack every few months for the first while and then there is the 95, then 95b, 95C, 98, 98se, etc…. XP is a mature product and even though I am an all Linux user I can at least acknowledge XP’s good attributes because all OSes come with bad ones.
-Socratez
To think that micorsoft doesn’t suck is to be in true denial. You people who support them are so blind of their past behaviours.
What happened to BEOS
What happened to netscape
etc etc etc ….. Maybe a thousand companies they have destroyed but what is worse is their technological backwardness. You might think windows XP is good and crash proof now but many people used GUI systems in the 80’s that didn’t crash. Where are those technologies now? Abandoned because it was too expensive to fight Microsofts monopoly power.
Supporting Microsoft is equivalent to saying the IT industry should go backwards.
This commentary does make a point, maybe not presented all that well, but anyway. I for one run Linux, mainly due to the fact that the whole DRM ordeal bothers me and I don’t want to be tied down. That’s my case. If other people want to be like everyone else, fine. The Linux vs. Windows wars are pretty irritating to me at least from both ends. Yes, Windows users bash Linux even though they’ve never seen it (most of them anyway), Linux users who might not have used Windows since 9x bash away. XP is a decent OS, but I build my own computers and I’ll be damned if I’m going to replace something and have to ask for a code and hope I get it. I also think Linux has proven itself a tad better to me than Windows. That’s my choice. A lot of people aren’t like me, I accept that, and what they use is their business. Maybe if more people would just leave it that way we could all get along a little better, and that would go for things that MATTER too. An OS holy war is trivial, and I happen to really like computers and I still think that. Some people around here and on sites like /. need to wake up to that.
MS used to be a neat company back in the early 90’s. They had fingers in all sorts of dev tools for all sorts of OS. Part of the reason for so many win developers is the great tools they made early on.
That said, something changed when win95 got big. MS started tying more and more stuff into the os and abandoning the other dev tools. If I had stock, I’d be upset. By all rights, MS should be making Linux tools. They don’t invent stuff anyway, it’s not their forte. Making hard stuff easy is what they’re good at.
Most people bash MS because their ego is driving them in the wrong direction-away from customers. I have no problem with using windows, but they have become absolutely abusive to resellers, competitors, and consumers! I agree with the article, each os has a place. Unfortunately, MS doesn’t get that, and refuses to play fair; openly says it won’t get along! From a decison standpoint, that is a black flag to stay away from them. Business wise they can’t be trusted [neither can Apple] for consistancy of planning more than 18 months away anymore. Their business plans are not something I would stake my comanies health on anymore.
Frankly, I am beginning to love my AS/400! True it’s older, but it gets the job done easily, doesn’t make radical changes, and is still keeping up features with all of the other common server OSes! My one AS400 can do what would take a herd of MS or linux boxes to do and remain rock stable and never loose data! I’m sure in a different environment [I’m small business] other systems would work too, but the “right” tool for the job should be important…Of couse the tools should work together easily…
And back then [late 1970’s] there wasn’t a really difference betweeen desktop pcs and server pcs like there is today.
Ah no, if anything the difference was much larger. Desktops meant terminals so the “desktop OS” had to be able to connect to the mainframe or mini. Features for a desktop OS were things like history. Conversely server OSes were highly sophisticated enterprise style OSes. Multics, S370, VMS, etc…
The notion of servers as systems running on OS similar to the desktop OS didn’t take off till things like Sun’s “the network is the computer” and Microsoft’s Lan manager almost a decade later.
He didn’t touch the question which was reason to write the article in the first place, that is whether MS sucks or not. And if it does suck, why shall I stop bashing it..? Only because it sucks for so long by now? – No my friend. There is no correlation between MS sucking and crashing/not crashing – there are a gazillion reasons apart from that. In fact, I don’t see a point at all in the article.
You guys and gulls should check out this domain:
http://www.boycottmicrosoft.org/
Expect a surprise!
After a hard day at work with both W2K, W98, and Unix machines, I want something that turns on, and is easy to work with minimal fuss.
So I just installed 2003 Server RC2 and want to update my drivers. Install VIA 4-in-1, Nvidia Drivers, SB Audigy, etc. The driver installer simply detects which chipset is present, installs the appropriate driver, reboot and it works. Using the latest distro of RedHat 8, changing the drivers took 4 hours of monkeying around in command prompt to get the gui back up and running. Then changing the color depth also plunged the os back to command line.
Now I’m sure if the tables were reversed and Linux was the dominant o/s, Linux would be the front of bashing.
*** Side Note ***
MS has security updates constantly coming up, and I used to think that there were too many problems. Once I subscribed to the RedHat letter, now I often get 2-to-3 security updates a week, for months at a time, ouch.
I have been all over the technology from support to building to managing to telecom and have used Many OS’s and many different pieces of hardware. I have found that the reason ANY OS exists is because there is a need/market for it. Did you know that your telephone goes thru what is basically a Macintosh Classic running an HP/UX variant? How about your credit card transactions going thru a ES/9000 Mainframe that is managed By a Sun Enterprise box and backup managed on a HP Netserver Running Windows NT? Or your F5 firewall running NetBSD?
You pick the best tool for the job. you don;t paint a car with a brush, you don;t paint your house with spraypaint and you don;t paint your walls with fingerpaint. May the best tool win.
10 years in this industry and i’m still under 30…Old and crusty, eh?
MS has security updates constantly coming up, and I used to think that there were too many problems. Once I subscribed to the RedHat letter, now I often get 2-to-3 security updates a week, for months at a time, ouch.
Has it occurred to you that you are getting Redhat Security Updates for any software on any of the 4 cds in their distro that anyone may have installed on the computer? With MS update you are getting updates on the OS, the Media Player, and IE. There Redhat is supporting a whole lot more software (much of which you may not even have installed).
OSNEWS
Expounding on the Future of Apple and Microsoft computing.
Doing our best to belittle open source operating systems.
Ugh. What a grotesque article. It doesn’t even pass grammar check in Microsoft Office. And I think that says it all.
I am by no means a Microsoft fan. If it were up to me, I wouldn’t use any of their operating systems or products. Wait, I don’t anymore, well with the exception of the X-box.
With that said, I have read a few comments that MS is to be blamed for what happened to Netscape. Did MS really kill Netscape or did Netscape kill itself. I recalled that Netscape had an insane strangle hold on the web browser market back in its hey days. People used it because it was better than IE. However, as IE matured, it became better than Netscape so people naturally started using IE more and more. If Netscape continued to put out a better browser, wouldn’t people have continued to use it? Some of you will argue that IE had an unfair advantage because it was bundled with the operating system. That might be true, but if it didn’t meet the needs of the users, wouldn’t they have downloaded/purchased the Netscape browser?
I agree with the points that the article is making. But, other points are missing.
MS is a monopoly. A healthy market needs at least one more player to keep quality up and price down. What if the world had only one oil company or one airline or one car maker? Another point is MSs fanatic focus on dominance and money at the expense of the techinical side. At the time MS was about to launch NT I was looking forward to an even nicer developers platform than what OpenVMS already was. But not so. Windows was ugly, unstructured, a hodge podge, documentation in bits and pieces, etc.
The road ahead of major innovations is way shorter and a lot bumpier than the road behind. The economy shows that. With MS trapped like that leaves Linux, Java or whatever a chance to catchup.
…but thank god, we have got OSNews.
So we can do some pretty Apple and Steve Jobs bashing instead.
Do you remeber that big court case where Microsoft was found guilty of using their Monopoly to crush a competing company/product out of existance? That was Netscape.
no.
“Linux is not ready for the desktop” is the most cliched non-sequitor I see in technology sites like this one.
Typically it appears something like this…
Linux installation does not recognize usb scanners. It is not ready for the desktop.
There is no Flash plugin for Linux. It is not ready for the desktop.
The editing of text files is required to configure Linux. It is not ready for the desktop.
These type of statement and conclusions are not only non-sequitors, they are most often false.
Maybe the reviewer does not like something about Linux, and prefers Windows, or some other operating system. There is no problem with this. The conclusion is then “Linux is not ready for MY desktop”
Making the universal conclusion is at best, specious, at worst, lying.
Cheers!
oh and someone should HIDE THE FIRST DIGITS OF OUR IP ADRESSES!
finally someone who can point this out
i’ve spend hours on damn forums and in IRC chatrooms, getting mad at people bashing microsoft, and saying linux is better, and all that WHILE THEY ARE ON WINDOWS>
im telling you winodws xp has NEVER ONCE crashed on me.
its the most stable MS OS ever.
so u all can shut the hell up with ur stupid teenie little comments about microsoft.
if u dont like it, then DO uninstall windows, an DO live with linux for all of ur life, and do NOT buy ms office,
ANY windows games, DONT JUST DONT!!!
And after living with that for 6 months, you can THINK about MAYBE telling people how microsoft sucks
AND DONT DO IT OFF TOPIC IN FORUMS THAT DONT EVEN HAVE TO DO IT YOU ANNOYING FREAKS!!!
You go in a surfing forum, ask what is the highes wave u’ve ever ridden? they say, microsoft sucks
a-hole
bah
im mad again
thanks to the author of this wonderful article
<noheader></noheader>
i know, i know its not an ip adress its the host name, and i still dont like it
I have both Windows 2000 and Debian Linux here. Windows 2000 seems to be pretty stable, as is Linux. My win2000 soundcard crashes the system sometimes, however.
You might want to know which Microsoft OS I find the best. Well, it is Windows 3.11. It has never really crashed for me, if a program locked up CtrlAltDel-Enter solved the problem. It even did with ms-dos programs. And you could run Dos games within Windows 3.11.
Now I am really happy with Debian. Though apt-get is not as user-friendly as InstallShield, it works good enough. Now the one thing Linux really needs is an easy application install wizard, for example you select Mozilla from the Internet Applications and then it automatically uses apt-get, apt-cdrom or such to install it. Maybe with .so backends for different packagers and distros? for example, debian.so will use aptitude, redhat.so just installs from cd-rom and mayme also mdk.so?
I started reading an article about Microsoft bashing, but finished with an article about Novell and which OS is better for which environment. I think you went off-track.
Sure, there’s bad criticism of Windows. So what? There’s bad criticism of Linux too. It’s nothing to get worked up over. There are also perfectly valid criticisms of Windows, often in areas you wouldn’t expect. For instance, its software installation – “package management” – which is so loose as to be almost non-existent, leading to massive problems when you actually try and install much software. Or Windows XP’s complete lack of interest in providing drivers for old hardware…to take just two utterly invalid points from the first page of this article.
(And Windows *does* still crash, too. I used XP, for about a year, plus a year previously in beta form. It crashed a lot less than Windows 98, which tends to fall over in a slight breeze, but a hell of a lot more than Linux ever has).
all you geeks keep picking on poor ol’ microsoft. you should all stop that immediately. winders doesn’t crash all the time. no. no. no. no!
waahhhhhhhh! i want my mommy!
No, WindowsXP doesn’t crash, Microsoft has fixed that one, it just responds less.
The problem isn’t with “Windows” security leaks, it’s with “Microsoft” security leaks. The vast majority of buggy software comes from Microsoft, IE is so buggy it’s laughable. Then Microsoft puts out an advertisement saying that Windows is so secure it would make hackers extinct (which they were told to remove, due to it being a lie).
Microsoft IS buying everything and bundling to stifle competition, Microsoft hates competition! File formats that produce a lock-in are one of the most low-down tactics of all, it’s how Microsoft forces people to upgrade.
You wonder why people bash Microsoft. Sheesh. I’m tired of people trying to make excuses for Microsoft.
http://www.euronet.nl/users/frankvw/IhateMS.html
http://www.kmfms.com/whatsbad.html
http://www.hevanet.com/peace/microsoft.htm
http://www.opensource.org/halloween
The osnews readers have spoken eh?
This forum is nowadays far worse than slashdot.
People don’t like to hear all this MS bashing because they don’t want to be the only people left behind when everyone else converts to *nix.
Simply amazing. People completely isolated from the real world gathering for a giant MS bash fest.
A disgrace to Linux and open source.
I leave in disgust.
I bought MSDOS6, Windows 3.0, 3.1, 3.11, 95,98, and NT. My wifes computer has ME. I consider each one of those crap software. I decided that I wasn’t going to buy into the Microsoft marketing BS. i gave MS PLENTY of money for mostly substandard products. EACH ONE promised to be better, faster, more reliable, blah, blah blah.
WHY should I take MS word once AGAIN, and give them more money ONCE AGAIN for a product that will no doubt give me more problems (XP phone home!!). A product that’s most likely loaded with MS spyware. Maybe XP is stable. I don’t care. Why should I trust MS ????
I don’t bash as much because i actually did something about it. Bought a dual-G4 Mac and love it. Then bought BeOS for my x86 computer. I am still getting really tired of people needing help to fix their windows computer.
Oh yea… I still have a huge stack of unused punchcards that I use for notepaper. I’ve never seen a reader though, but just having the them makes a good conversation piece.
“I don’t bash as much because i actually did something about it.”
You did, and what’s more, you’re approaching the new operating system with an attitude based upon rumours, and rumours which existed before the OS appeared.
Windows cannot be based purely on the OS itself for it’s stability. It relies for the most part, too heavily on Drivers, and these Drivers are made by thirdparty businesses for the consumer’s product. There are many substandard coded drivers out there which happily brings a PC system down. I’ve seen it often myself. Just as I have with Linux aswell.
When Windows is fully supported by ‘solid’ Drivers, the crashes are minimal, as then the battle is upon handling the hardware, and the reliability of the hardware.
Eg.
“Omg, Windows XP just crashed and now I can’t do anything with it” Little realising that they have a Voodoo card in there that isn’t supported, or something of that ilk.
It’s like a body rejecting a kidney which it didn’t grow up with.
Why even bother with this fight? Some people like Windows, some like Linux and some like others.
I, myself, have Windows XP AND Redhat Linux 8 installed on the same PC, as well as Windows XP on another and Redhat Linux 8 on another.
I frequently find myself using Windows XP more often because of what I need to do. I use Linux for my servers and Windows for my desktops, to me that seems logical.
All these people saying that Windows crashes and crap, I am a beta tester and I installed numerous beta programs on both Windows and Linux and I find that Linux crashes more than Windows does. It’s all based on your computers, mentality, preference and lifestyle. I don’t think that one is better than the other. They are all good for there own reasons. I just wish people would accept that.
My soundcard is a CMI/8330, sb16 compatible. The Windows 2000 CMI driver constantly crashes my computer. So I thought, well, let’s install an SB16 driver. But it didn’t work, the installer complained I did not have the proper hardware
and no possibility to tell it I don’t care it is not a real SB. That stupid Windows driver should do what I tell it to do, and should not be “intelligent” and prevent my computer from working correctly.
In Linux, the CMI driver for Alsa is crap, it does not even work, but there I can at least install the SB driver. And it works.
For a nice anti-Microsoft page: http://toastytech.com/evil/ . Take a look at it, it is very funny.
Heydays of punched cards and you are only 35?
Excuse me but take it from this old man who has been earning a living in the computer industry since vacuum tube days (IBM-1401, etc.) punched (or Hollerith) cards were passe a darn site longer than 20 years ago and I doubt you were doing much working for a living at 15.
It has been my experience that when you blow smoke so early on in your presentation, it doen’t make one very interested in reading further.
This reminds me of the retarded generalisations made towards anti-war protestors as being a bunch of pacifist hippies who don’t look at the big picture. I think you’ll find that very few people are anti-MS without good reason.
“ming the merciless,” above, and many others, pretty much summed up what my perspective on this is. Microsoft is solely responsible for any bad image it has. I think that the more people poke at them and demonstrate the problems, the more likely Microsoft is to change them (reluctantly, but that’s how you make big, bloated organizations that don’t give a rat’s ass about customers or product quality to actuall CHANGE anything: you embarass them).
BUT: I am sick to death of the people who waste bandwidth with trolling and knee-jerk responses. I am sick of people who can’t form a sentence or use punctuation simply because they’re too lazy and ignorant (and likely too young) to do so. If you have a complaint, voice it. But voice it correctly with some amount of respect to the people who will read it. Otherwise, you’re just another punk kid leaving tags on railway cars.
By the way… I can’t spell very well (compared to a spell checker) and writing beautifully in a forum response is kind of pointless… But if I wrote an article that was going to be posted to a News Site, I would spell-check it, proof read it and probably have a third party read it for clarity and readability. I think that OS News might want to consider placing a few filters on their editorial posting procedures to increase the general quality. No one should ever submit a first draft (which is what this appears to be, to my eyes). And this has nothing to do with bashing people who use English as a non-primary language – it has to do with using ANY language correctly.
Pacifist Hippies, War-mongering red-necks
Anti-M$ geeks, Pro Microsoft Losers
Everybody wants to think that thiers is the correct viewpoint and everybody else is an extremist on the fringes of reality. It’s human nature to dismiss disenting viewpoints as unreasonable.
Maybe if everybody just took the merits of each others arguments then progress could be made. as it stands though, Pro MS people dismiss out of hand the potential of what they see as a ‘legacy’ OS. And *Nix people seem to be more likely to sell their children to slavery than admit that occasionally an MS solution might be the best fit.
I find that in reality that most real people are much more moderate when actually tasked with implementing a solution to a real world problem.
This article — amen. The nail was hit on the head.
Microsoft bashers — if you were truly magnanimous toward all OS technology, you would appreciate Windows for its diffuse use, its end-user facility, and its substantial role in OS development.
Windows was an OS progenitor (of whom rose to the top subsequent to the 80s/90s OS bout), so give it a little more respect, OK?
In the OS biz for over 25 years,
Nathan
Listen.
I run Win2000 at work, no it doesn’t crash, but, it’s got a great bug, send a email have Windows Explorer FREEZE. Go to Task Manager to delete it before you can do any work. MS is the King of the Screw ups.
My company controls the os on my desktop,
so I may have to live with this bug for 2 more years.
When ever I hear an MS exec talk about how great it is that WinXP’s 3,000,000 lines of code compiled. I just say: “Sheesh”.
These boneheads are praising the 1st step in the development cycle,
why? because they don’t have a Second Step. Testing.
Just installed IEsp1 on Windows ME,
destroyed the machine’s bootup process.
Got to love’em.
I’ve learned to GHOST my machine because of MS quality.
Wars?
Did MS ask you if you wanted a CLONE of JAVA that only ran on Windows? Nope. Bill, we want JAVA, not a lower quality, bug ridden MS knock off, with memory leaks, and pointer problems.
MS is at WAR with their USERs, DEVELOPERS, and CUSTOMERS.
No other company rams more crap down their paying user’s throats.
RIAA, Trusted Computing? Stupid Languages, 6 different Database technologies. MS just bought a JDBC driver for SQL,
the slowest, buggies version available. Did the developers feel a Kinship to this code? Or was Gates Too Cheap to buy the better version?
Languages: Worst Languages in the World.
Thanks for VB6 Bill. The “C” of Com, DCom and Com+.
What’s to Praise?
Bill’s cunning business plans?
Bill’s management staff? The only people that get ahead at MS are the losers who can find a way to subvert a good open source idea and convert it to a MS disaster.
Hotmail? Microsoft reserves the right to Read your email,
steal your business plans and/or your code? This was in the EULA.
Why did they put it there if that isn’t exactly what they were doing?
Innovation+Ethic. I switched to Apple.
Apple isn’t at war with the developer community.
MS will never get 1 dollar more out of me.
The problem with M$ is that your partices are abusive. Even if M$ make good products, you are f***ed if you depend of M$.
This is the reason why any intelligent person must try to not depend of M$ products. Free software is the more definitive alternative.
I have been in the industry for over 15 years, I see and agree with points on both sides. Today Windows is not the problem it is “Microsoft” the monopoly that in the past produced sub-productive products that with no compitition they could and did get away with it, until about 6 years ago when Linux was recognized as an up and coming competitor. No matter where Linux ends up the entire world needs to be appreciative that it single handedly will change the quality of Microsoft products
more to come
The day I go back to a Microsoft OS because of ease-of-use, I’m going to kill myself. Its that easy. I’d rather spend a few extra hours (yes hours,) if thats what it takes to get something working, than running an OS that crashes alot, doesnt do the job well, handles memory like a 2year old does his/her toys, and was stolen from the beginning. Its hypocritical of Microsoft to sell something that they stole from the very start, and have built all their forward products on. And thats another interesting fact; Have any of your Microsoft sympathizers failed to realize that you are running DOS (the OS, yes) with a bigger and… err… well nothing more, shell?
And another thing; Since when is the ‘install/uninstall’ a problem in Linux/Gnu? I run debian and I do:
‘apt-get install <app>’ and ‘apt-get remove <app>’ to uninstall. That wasnt so hard to grasp, now was it?
that wasnt so hard was it? Get your facts straight before pissing on those of us who have the balls to stand for what we think is right.
P.S. You have failed to include the “Gnu” part of the actual name. Its ‘Linux/Gnu’! That a rookie makes the mistake is one thing, but someone like yourself? Oh damn… D.S.
I work all day with Windows 2000 machines at work. I have no problem loading Microsoft Brand office applications time after time. But when it comes down to the 3rd party apps, I am just sick of it. We use some software that requires you to reboot first thing in the morning, and about midway through the day. I was thinking and saying we should get this program on the Unix platform or something (Linux etc..) but then I thought about it. Who is at fault here? Why are Microsoft apps so stable while 3rd party apps suck ass? Could it be that there are APIs or something that the 3rd parties don’t know about? I am no programmer at all but if Microsoft is withholding some information in reguard to how applications use memory or whatever etc.. This should change. 3rd party apps shouldn’t crash the system, and a Windows 2000 box shouldn’t be unstable because of a horrible written program. This is why I like the Microsoft certified drivers / proggies getting focus now. I just wish the software I use at work would be certified and written properly. Clue me in someone. What is going on specifically with the programming world. Is it hard to write stable programs unless you are fully in bed with Microsoft? I dunno, I have tried for years to get away from instability and find Windows XP has its problems as well. And ALL of the time it’s because I am using 3rd party applications. WHY IS THIS? please feedback me. Thanks
I’d rather spend a few extra hours (yes hours,) if thats what it takes to get something working, than running
See, that’s the point. Different people have different priorities. As a college student, I don’t have any free time. My printer comes with instructions on how to install the driver for Windows, and they work. In my opinion, this is a more valuable use of my time to install it in 15 minutes, rather than spending the time getting it to work on FreeBSD with CUPS.
thats what it takes to get something working, than running an OS that crashes alot, doesnt do the job well, handles memory like a 2year old does his/her toys, a
Most Windows bashers love to use Windows 95 and then report back to the community how wonderful it is. I suppose I should go install Redhat 5.0 and let you know how well it works.
And thats another interesting fact; Have any of your Microsoft sympathizers failed to realize that you are running DOS (the OS, yes) with a bigger and… err… well nothing more, shell?
If by interesting, you mean nonsensical and irrelevant, right on. XFree86 runs on top of the Linux console, so what? And DOS is only emulated in NT, but of course you’re still using W95.
Get your facts straight before pissing on those of us who have the balls to stand for what we think is right.
Same for you. My OS isn’t a choice of idealogy, its a choice of what works best for my. Best tool for the job- I’m sure you have heard of that.
Its ‘Linux/Gnu’! That a rookie makes the mistake is one thing, but someone like yourself?
It’s actually Gnu/Linux, and whether or not it should be prepended to Linux is optional. There is no licensing clause in RMS’ software that forces you to add this. Do you remember RMS bitching about the old BSD license because it required to give the original author credit? Loss of freedoms and all that.
And another thing; Since when is the ‘install/uninstall’ a problem in Linux/Gnu? I run debian and I do:
‘apt-get install <app>’ and ‘apt-get remove <app>’ to uninstall. That wasnt so hard to grasp, now was it?
So it works well for you on your particular distribution? Well what about the other 199 linux distributions? Should eeryone switch to Debian, and just get rid of the advantages of all the other distributions (like the actual testing RH has done) ? I’m glad you have solved the entire package management problem.
Oh and I’m developing this great new software for Linux. To provide installation files for every distribution, all I have to do is make an Redhat RPM, emerge build script, Mandrake RPM, apt package, etc, etc. Maybe that’s why hardware support for Linux is limited. It’s nearly impossible to provide support for the myriad of distributions and configurations. There’s nothing wrong with choice (you choose RPM package management, I choose portage and packages), but at the end of the day – it’s probably not going to work out well for both of us if you we both want packages supported by the creator.
As far as I know is DOS = Disk Operating System
And M$ suxxx
I have much experience in windowz since v. 3.11, many things got better but too much get worser …
I LUV my Debian machine and the TCPA is just one more reason not to use Micro$uck WindowZ
I don’t get it. All of you keep complaining about stuff not working with windows. Theres a LOT more stuff that don’t work with another operating system than windows. Personally, I’ve never had any hardware problems with windows. It always just works. No configuration necessary. Maybe instead of buy el-cheapo hardware from mr esd black market, buy some quality products and then see if you got any problems. And before you blame windows for problems, make sure your hardware is actually good, and installed properly and setup properly in ur bios (if needed). As for third party software crashing, well then the third party software probably has bugs. I don’t find microsoft software any less buggy than third parties. But when any of them crashes, I can always terminate it in the task manager. So for you freeloading hippie *nix, and apple loosers, get a life.
….but I would do all I can to tell folks just what MS is, in reality:: a monopolistic, criminal organization that gives true free capitalism a bad name by lying, perjury, deceptive tactics, immoral and a-moral behavior, disloyal competitive practices; the production of poor, topheavy, bloated, crasy and totally insecure software; and general incompetence in coding practices. There, you can plainly see that I have not placed myself in a position to catch the notorious Stockholm Syndrome.
We all must bash microsoft more, i bash for every Dollar that Microsoft has in the bank,
…If you hate it so much, then learn to use something else. Whining won’t make it go away. The reason Microsoft exists is because people just complain and will never do anything. Stop griping and make something work better if you know what you’re talking about.
I’m sure you’re not criticizing my posts, which are always well reasoned, on point and factually address the flaws in Microsoft products. I’m also sure that you have the same views about the spurious bashing of Mac OS X and Linux. As to your earlier post on the updates issue, I recommend that you take a look at Microsoft’s licensing terms — unless an organization is willing to pay a prohibitively high price, these terms _require_ companies to agree in advance to a 2 or 3 year upgrade cycle for the OS and for Office.
Hey Karl: It’s “heyday,” not “hey days.” Yeesh.
Congrulations, nice article that pretty much describe what I think.
Windows is great. Linux is great. Stop being so prejeduce.
.. also. All those complaints that windows crashes and this and that. I must say that 99 percent of those errors and crashes are due to USER ERROR. The other one percent is due to third party drivers in which the company that distributes them, show ignorance to Microsoft’s WHQL.
As far as linux goes, to winning the fame on the computer as a main desktop OS, I have to say that they have a lot of work to do and a long road to travel before that happens.
Yowz,
As this is turning out to be a flame forum yet again, I’m wondering how do all of you flamers get the time to flame?
Untill linux has taken over desktops, you have to program, _not_ flame. Flaming doesn’t get you the market lead, programming does.
So you ppl will never flame again.
One thing, why can’t the f*cking 200 distro compains _agree_ on standards? just make 1 standard and use that in every distro… like the packaging and installing…
Greetz and happy programming
,
— daRoBBie.
In response to some of the comments made on my previous post;
A) No, we should not all switch to debian. I’m just saying that I have no problem with installing/uninstalling. So I chose Debian because it makes it (atleast somewhat) easier to migrate from the Windows environment. And I’m not saying that all other dists suck because they dont have dpkg, but it makes things one hell of alot easier.
B) Redhat? Are we seeing a pattern here? As soon as a Microsoft lover notices “linux” somewhere, he immediately thinks “Redhat”, its sad.
C) I can certainly understand the ones who does not have enough time to solve their issues regarding hardware related problems that they might have with Linux. I totally understand. But did it ever occur to you that you will learn how to deal with these issues the more you use it? When I first started using Debian, I had basically no idea what the fuck I was doing. I barely knew the commands for console. So? I read alot… and now everything I do in Debian goes alot faster than it did on my Windows2k box.
D) Did someone mention XFree86? Uhm… How the fuck can you compare XFree86 to DOS and its companions? Did it ever occur to you that the API running in Windows is from 1993 and filled with more security holes than you can count? Not much have changed in the Microsoft area.
And wtf is all this talk about Windows95? I’ve used every Microsoft OS from Dos -> WinXP. I hate them all besides Win2k. It’s actually quite good compared to all others. WinXP crashed constantly after installing Mozilla so I wont give that another thought.
Quit saying that we *nix users only compare to Win95, because thats bullshit.
“Windows is great. Linux is great. Stop being so prejeduce.”
No, they’re both shit, unfortunately it seems very few know makes a good OS and most that started with Windows just don’t care.
You bet I’m tired of the bashing. But if that’s the most horrible thing they can do, let them rant. I, too, have worked in IT for many, many, years; using many different Operating Systems – DOS, Unix, Linux, MacOS, Solaris, and Windows. I like them all, for different reasons. You just work with what is best for the job at hand. It’s just a tool, not the end of the universe! I don’t hate the tools I use – if a particular one doesn’t work, I’ll fix it, or move on to another. I do _not_ waste my breath on crying about it. One last thing – according to #4 in OSNews’ terms: “Mindless bashing at Microsoft or *any other* OS vendor IS NOT ALLOWED.” So why is it still here?
Ok, all the people who are tired of M$ bashing, just ask why should M$ not be bashed. One thing everyone in this industry understand that M$ never gave anything *new* to the world with their collective creativity, all they have been doing is stealing ideas from others. They pretty well knew that people cry faul for sometime before everyone gets over with it. That is what happening now and someone comes up with a thread saying stop bashing M$.
When I hear anyone say they read sites like those listed in this article for technical information I tune right out. It’s like saying you get serious world news from MTV news.
its quite simple people, you buy or build a new 2ghz+ pc, you dont want to waste it on linux, you use something thats going to make your life easier not more difficult.
windows: easy to install and use, good driver support, has a very high amount of decent games and applications available.
linux: realy only good to use as a server os, ftp, http, etc. games = hah! apps = WTF.
mac: macs are decent for graphics manipulation software, thats about it.
“Personally, I’ve never had any hardware problems with windows. It always just works. No configuration necessary. Maybe instead of buy el-cheapo hardware from mr esd black market, buy some quality products and then see if you got any problems.”
Hmmm. So if Linux works on cheap hardware and Windows doesn’t… it’s the fault of the hardware? I guess not. If it works with Linux, it should also work with Windows.
Now replace Windows with Solaris:
“Personally, I’ve never had any hardware problems with Solaris. It always just works. No configuration necessary. Maybe instead of buy this €1.000 PC, buy this €20.000 UltraSparc and then see if you got any problems.”
About Linux Package Managers: it is a hell, indeed. The advantage of all those seperate packages, is that for instance you don’t need to download libpng ten times, eg with KDE, with The Gimp, with Gnome, with Analog, with …
However, there is no definition how programs should be split up, so distribution A ships libpng.rpm, distro B ships libpng2.rpm and libpng_dev.rpm, distro C might call the latter libpng_devel.rpm… making it all incompatible. And there isn’t the force of one authority (MS, Apple) to force a standard.
So I guess the Linux Standard Base should propose some kind of standard libraries that should be installed, then all extra software (INCLUDING their libraries to avoid dll hell) goes into /opt/somepackage/. Removing that dir removes the package. As far as I know this would be LSB compliant, though it makes installation of programs as easy of copying them to /opt.
And to conclude with something ontopic: I guess both Windows and Linux have their strengths, Linux in webservers and such… I mainly use Windows for using Delphi… don’t bash Microsoft, don’t bash Linux, just tell why you like the os you like… as isn’t it boring to read over and over again that Windows crashes all time, that Linux really also has security holes, that M$ sucks and that Linux isn’t “ready” for the Desktop?