This month’s Wired magazine has a terriffic story about a team of students from a high school in an economically depressed part of Phoenix, who took part in an underwater-robot building competition against students from the top universities in the country — and won. All of the students are undocumented Mexican immigrants who don’t qualify for most financial aid or even in-state tuition, and therefore can’t afford to attend college, in the US, Mexico, or anywhere. When I read the article I determined to try to do something to help give these kids their chance, and I was delighted to discover that their faculty advisor has set up a scholarship fund for them, and I’m about to donate some money to help. I’d like to encourage OSNews readers to read the story, and if they feel the same way, to donate.
First of all, i am not an US Citizen, i am from Romania(if you ask french people next to my age where is Romania, they tell you “… somewhere arround rome…”.
1) My sallary is 400 $ / month.
2) I am daily student at state faculty(no fee).
3) 22 Years of age,currently 3rd year of total 5 of university.
4) Its illegal to be illegal (Dont go out of your own country by illegal means, only your country abuses you <-“All of you posters that live in good democratic countrys, let us, the ones that were not born so lucky, tell you that a whole country might be against you(unfair reasons, and in that moment you are morraly, not a citizen of that country anymore)-your country behaves illegal to you”->
5) Better countrys are exactly like better people, they try to help the not so strong ones(imho this is utopic/politic related issue)
6) The world, not just US, but everyone MUST promote the tallents.
7) To americans out there, dont be so “shauvinistc”! Remember that there is no real “usaian”, or “californian”, or “texan” or “newyorkan”… what the world so called best democracy was built upon was ideals and great behaveours of foreign people that didnt like the systematisation from their countrys.
8) Shame on all of you, that you dont try to put a serious note to this post, you all become rasists, shavinistics, xenofobs.
This whole POST should be canceld.
I see mature, grown up people expresing ideeas as old as in the slabory period. Shame on you!
To study history and past philosophy is golden. It enables us to avoid committing the same mistakes of our ancestors. The point isn’t to throw out all ideas of the past, or those thought of by others. You are correct that to adopt “good ideas” is, in fact, a “good idea” — no matter where they come from. The point here is that the specific idea you brought out about stubborn loyalty to one’s culture of origin is *not* a good idea. This in no way implies that all of Socrates ideas are bad. The fact that Socrates made these observations is irrelevant. Socrates was not perfect. I will not attribute more weight to an idea than it deserves just because Socrates said it — even if I may agree with many or all other things he said. No idea should be judged based on who advanced it. If the idea is sound, let it stand on its own.
BTW, I’m quite aware of what Socrates was “about”, but contrary to your affirmation, the mention of his name is *not* sufficient to establish *your* dedication to self. Anyone can drop a name. Socrates would likely be appalled by your use of his words as infallable truth.
Had these students been illegal immigrants to Australia they would probably (along with their families) have immediately been arrested and interred at a migrant detention centre (aka a high security prison) while their cases were being reviewed (up to 3 years). These centres are in some of the most inhospitible and isolated spots in Australia – equivalent to the middle of the Nevada desert. Since they would have no legitimate case as refugees they would then be deported. The government also bills them for all costs incurred for accomodation, legal fees, flights home etc.
Strangely enough we don’t have many illegal immigrants arriving in Australia.
I wonder what happens when I break the law in Mexico, Canada, or any other country other than the grand old USA. (Maybe it’s only okay to break the law in the USA)
@iongion
technically speaking, there are no true “romanians” out there either.
Let everyman do what he thinks is right in is own mind.
God bless America and all the Gentile Nations : Europe ,
Japan and Australia.
In Australia we have what is known as a Tax File Number. If you don’t provide it your employer is legally obliged to deduct 49% of your wages as tax. It is also a very serious offence to employ illegal immigrants (or pay employees off the books). Illegal immigrants also have no access to health services, education, banks, driver licenses, rental accomodation etc. Government agencies also frequently raid companies that employ illegal immigrants. At a large company I once worked for immigration agents checked the identities of all who arrived for work.
If they’re here illegally then they should be exported. I don’t care if they are “geniuses”. I’ll put it bluntly, if you don’t come here legally you don’t have a right to be in the country nor do you have any right to obtain a scholarship or loan. Geez people, shut down the Mexican/US border, build a wall backed up with armed guards. I AM SICK of these people leeching off of my country!!!
You know, if it’s against the law, why aren’t their ever this many comments defending the DMCA, the RIAA or the MPAA tactics? Why aren’t people satisfied with the Microsoft ruling. They were found guilty, and they were punished. It’s over with.
If it’s against the law, why do people still speed? After all, that still costs us money.
Maybe people like the law, and feel it’s morally right. After all, if it’s the law, it can’t be wrong. And anyone who breaks the law is evil. And deserves to be punished.
Next time the RIAA sues a 12 year old, I am sure you will be supporting them every step of the way.
And none of you have every pirated any music, I am sure. And are completely happy with the DMCA. Hell, it’s the law! You have to support it.
And to think, the US was built on people who today would be breaking the law. Who today would be labeled terrorists.
To think, I served in the US military so my fellow citizens could stand up and say: “The government can do no wrong.”
You know, just because the law might say they need to be deported, they have proven themselves to be valuable members of society. The humane thing to do would be to give them a chance to prove themselves.
And for those people asking “Why not me?”, you’ve been given the opportunity from day one. More opportunities than these guys were given. So when you ask that question: ask it to yourself. Because if you aren’t going to college, it’s your own damn fault.
From someone who’s been there, and someone who is more ashamed each day of calling himself an American.
Most illegals are not paying taxes and are paid well below minimum wage in the under the table style. I guess either the IRS is lazy or there is some petty cash rule that allows them to not account for the few thousand a year they pay to day laborers to avoid paying the legal wage and get the cheap labor.
I’m against any illegal immigrant that is leaching off our taxes. If they’re being paid and paying taxes I have less of a problem with that. But facts are facts many border states public healthcare systems are being taxed by those who are not paying taxes and are hurting the legitimate taxpayers that risk losing a valuable public service. This is not just limited to healthcare there are many services they put a burden on without putting into it.
Also if anyone has studied the problem, illegal immigrants are the #2 source of money coming into the Mexican economy and that falls behind their Oil and Gas profits. It’s no wonder the government down there will not do anything about it other than promise action that will never take place.
“Those who favor giving free handouts to ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS are complete fuc*tards. “Oh, it’s not their fault.” “Oh, we’re pushing away OBVIOUS brillance.” “Aren’t we the land of the free?” Meanwhile, I can’t afford to send MY OWN KIDS to top-flight universities due to cost. And I’ve been PAYING TAXES for 25 years.”
I agree. I don’t think I should be sending your kids to school either. If you can’t send them to a good university, that’s their problem, and yours. Don’t blame it on anyone else but your own inability at being able to support your family. I don’t feel my taxes should go toward paying your kids tuition. Hell, they weren’t smart enough to get scholarships, they deserve whatever they get.
You couldn’t get a better job because of your lackluster skills? Your problem, not mine.
I am glad we see things eye to eye.
I now understand how George Bush got elected again because it seems like many of the small minded morons actually post here! Geeze! Where were all you guys when we went to war without cause? lack of energy policy in the US? US government stamping all over the rights of US citizens after 9/11? etc? etc? etc?
People like Rockwell are exactly what is wrong with this country, go back to your cave and turn on FOX news and while your at it, why don’t you join the Minutemen.
Everyone complaining about the illegal aliens need to stop and think for a moment.
Rather than go after the aliens, why not go after your fellow American’s that are paying them to do the work in the first place. After all, if they weren’t paying them, they wouldn’t come because they wouldn’t have any place to work. It’s really that simple.
At least for those of us who were able to make it to college. I’m sorry, I went. I can’t blame immigrants for my inability to go to a university.
Sorry but these kids shouldnt be penalised because of there immigrant parents or our own bullshit corrupt/broken system that doesnt want to give immigrants green cards anymore.
Why do we pay the ins,border patrole again?
Illegal immigrants is the immoral poloticians way of getting free money.Thats right…free money.After working and there employer paying benefits for there lifetime,the govt. doesnt have to pay back benefits because there…well…illegal.lol
what a scam they got going.
why is this crap posted here anyway?
I think someone from OSNews bet another fellow he could generate 200 or better comments with the right artical….you are all morons…:)
Ok ok ok, everyone has vented a bit of steam or whatever, but what about the fund? I for one will make a donation, it will make me glad I contributed to something positively.
I mean, even if they are thrown out, they could still use the money wherever they go, right?
And I dont buy the “I got no help, why should I help anyone else”-stuff. Everyone that feels mistreated, this is your chance to end a vicious circle of nobody caring or feeling like helping anyone else. Maybe if people start helping each other out any way they can, they will end up on the other side of that help occasionally.
The way I see it is that if you were unfairly treated, you can either put it behind you and try helping someone else (making sure they get the chance you didnt) or you can keep the bitterness forever and just attack anything that comes into range.
If money is a too big a sacrifice, how about just writing something nice or giving a positive comment here instead of all these “go home” posts.
“With regards to freedom of movement you and they do not have equal rights. You are discriminating against them.”
Legal immigrants have all the rights an American has, except the right to vote. People who violate the law loose their freedom of movement. These illegals made a choice not to follow the law when they jumped the border, rather than follow the due immigration process. Hence they loose their freedom of movement.
I have a colleague who is also a legal immigrant. He has his family back in Russia. He is following the due process to bring them over here. It will take him up to 5 years to complete the process (not the 18 years some one mentioned). When they finally arrive, they will be be able to enjoy all the freedoms America has to offer. On the other hand some illegal who wants to come the easy way without waiting their turn in a due process, looses the freedom offered.
People seem to focus on the concepts of ‘justice’ and ‘this great land of ours’. Now, I don’t condone illegal immigration, but let’s look at the big picture: We’re engaged in a war that is considered ‘illegal’ by many of our countryfolk and most of the world (yes, we should care what they think). We have favorite nations, favorite trading partners, a favorite tax-bracket (the extremely wealthy), we make and break the rules. If you think a couple of kids who build a robot symbolism the problem, get your head out of your ass.. the ‘real world’ will shock you.
Now, how ’bout them new AMD chips, eh?
> With all those papers they and you have equal rights. They
> and you have to go through the same procedure to get them.
Yes, we both have to abide by the laws and standards to acquire them. Much like immigration laws. Children that are born here are citizens, those that are not can immigrate like everyone else. And if they have children here, they too will be citizens.
Countries can and do choose to define the laws governing citizenship, much as they do many other things. And like with owning firearms, or who can pilot an airplane, there are prerequisites that not everyone will meet.
Those outside of the U.S. are not denied rights, they are simply not entitled to be members of the U.S. I have no claims to the pension system of Germany, either. Those bigots.
The best thing I can think of is to get the words out to the papers, news channels, and tv shows like Operah. It is quite a story, touches a lot of social problems in America. People will definitely dig it. With the publicity, these kids can get anywhere they want.
I may be a little naive. But I think it just might work.
Ray
> Did YOUR ancestors get permission to immigrate? Possibly,
> more than likely they just immigrated anyway. Shot a few
> natives and claimed the land. Hypocrites.
My ancestors didn’t get permission to put buildings on their land, either. They didn’t need to register handguns. They didn’t have to pay income taxes. They didn’t have to do a lot of things. Your historical knowledge is truly insightful.
But hey, my ancestors were those “natives,” being shot at. Thank you for fighting that good fight for me with your moral righteousness!
There’s this underlying assumption that immigrants are just draining resources from “honest hard working americans”; I find that hard to believe. I’ve never lost a job to someone whose lack of education only allowed them to take a job at a local mcdonalds, taco bell, the nearest field. Also, they pay taxes! The only “people” I know who don’t pay taxes are usually 1)wealthy or 2)corporate “entity” both seem to go hand in hand. So, my suggestion go back and get your GED; your already ahead of other people then. Next, get some motivation and work your own way up. Some people just forget that not so long ago their parents, grandparents, etc. were immigrants. Those that weren’t; well times change, keeping a monopoly to just those people you like, well it comes to an end eventually.
/
🙂
As far as I can tell, no one not trolling has expressed any qualms with actual immigrants, merely people that illegally enter the country. There are those of course that do not like immigrants at all, but they aren’t posting here. You’re arguing against positions that aren’t being taken in attempt to lend credence to your philosophy that because others previously did not have to meet legal requirements to enter the country, that others should not have to either.
“You never allow them to have one in the first place. Because they don’t have particular paper you require they are not allowed to move freely (from Mexico to US, for example). Just as before you didn’t give equal rights to those who didn’t have particular skin color you required.”
You just don’t get it! I don’t know where you guys get the Idea that the US does not allow foreigners in??!!
I am a legal alien in this country. I came into this country perfectly legally. Race has nothing to do with this. There are millions of others like me who came in legally. Visit the USCIS website (www.uscis.gov) to find out how to come to the US legally.
> Visit the USCIS website (www.uscis.gov) to find out
> how to come to the US legally.
All those tens of millions illegal immigrants are stupidly risking their well being, health, freedom and sometimes even life while it is actually very easy to move to US legally.
Stop spreading the lies. Except for “close relative” program, there is no meaningful legal way to immigrate to US. Of the millions immigrating to US legally 99% come through “close relative” program.
Umm… social security numbers are damn easy to get; its a piece of paper for god sake that they ask you not to laminate /at least here in arizona. WHich is why identity theft is so prevalent and other methods where faking a social security card exist. Also I believe that it is up to the business to check the validity of the numbers. It either costs them too much or thei’re “fishy”, hence, Most never run the numbers through and play a pretend game with state officials when they get caught. How the else do you think that Wal*Mart’s contract firms for cleaning handled its affairs; other companies frequently use the same method.
So, yes they still pay taxes; some people actually benefit as long as the illegal doesn’t commit any crimes with the number. For example, an illegal uses “Irene Lopez” and gets her social sec number now adds several years of work time and hence points to her score. The money was taken out in taxes; government ok. The only problem I can see is if the immigrant tries something funny but you don’t kill your free ride that way; your gonna want to come back and use the same name again. Yes, a real Irma Lopez does exist and yes, she was pissed when it happened to her but realized that otherwise she would not have been getting higher benefits. My kind of american. Sort of like a recent report that showed most americans underreported their incomes.
/get off your high horses
hahaha,
um other than them coming first and becoming those “close relatives”; which is now harder, your just hoping to “granddaddy” a bunch of people.
——————————————————-
Stop spreading the lies. Except for “close relative” program, there is no meaningful legal way to immigrate to US. Of the millions immigrating to US legally 99% come through “close relative” program.
“Stop spreading the lies. Except for “close relative” program, there is no meaningful legal way to immigrate to US. Of the millions immigrating to US legally 99% come through “close relative” program.”
If you have skills or knowledge that is useful for the country, you can easily come to the country on a work visa. Your employer can then file for a permanent residence with the USCIS who will then process the application on its merit. There are 65000 H1 visas issued this year , there is no number cap on the number of L1 visas, Many people on F1 visas become permanent residents etc
If everybody who wanted to come to the US could do so freely, you would find the trickle of immigration would become a flood. Then you would be having a major over population crisis. A country should have the right to choose who it wants to let in. This screening process has been gong on for well over a century (Visit Ellis island).
I bet you are careful in allowing who enters into your house? You just don’t let anyone who you don’t know in, do you? When required, you let in a stranger whose skill you need (like a plumber) in, but only after you are sure of his authenticity. So why this double standard when you government is doing something similar?
After posting about the legality of things, which seems to be the major focus of everything in this whole stinking mess, I read the article, and discovered THERE ARE NO STINKING ROBOTS CREATED BY THESE KIDS!
The Wired article was being irresponsible and vague when it comes to the definition of what a robot is. Heck, what these kids made wasn’t even a remote-control car via radio or other wireless means!!! What they made was sufficient to deliver a camera feedback to their monitoring equipment, and provide potentiometers for controlling the throttle to some motors: nothing more, nothing less. There was no computation involved in controlling the robot-that-isn’t-a-robot: no computer was involved, and no programmable system that did a programmed task.
Chances are, the MIT team may have actually used something that qualified as an actual robot, in that it was programmable, though that’s not mentioned in the story. After all, the story is all about these “genius” kids that designed and built a “robot” that beat the top universities in a contest. While they were resourceful in using tampons to soak up the leak, how long would that last? It’s fortunate they weren’t required to leave the “robot” in the water for more than a handful of hours, because tampons have their limits
And it’s true: “Robot Wars” and the like don’t use real robots, either, but they’re still more advanced than what these kids assembled: they’re not tethered by a wire. It would be much more impressive if these kids had designed and built a radio-controlled model airplane, including designing and building the radio transmitter and receiver.
So, I find myself asking: how on earth did such an unrelated story to anything related to computers and operating systems and the industry get submitted and posted on OSNews?
“Beaver, it’s all just an overhyped story of some kids putting together an expensive underwater toy! Now go home and play with your marbles!”
Undocumented???? why don’t you just say it like it is. Illegal. I’m going to college now and nobody is paying for it wish I could get a scholorship but I guess I’m too ‘documented’
undocumented -> illegal -> punish them?
What about:
attacking -> illigally entering another country -> punish them?
Things aren’t always black and white…
Some countries would be “put in quarantine” for attacking another state. Well… we aren’t being consequent in that for all countries, so get over it, and give them credit for at least trying to be good citizens…
Just wanted to add another comment. I see a lot of people in this forum keep saying that I as an American citizen should be nice to ‘Illegal Aliens’ because after all all Americans are immigrants. My -and almost everybody elses- families entered the country legally and became citizens right there and then. These kids are not immigrants they are illegals. They can go back accross the boarder and apply for American citizenship just like every other law abiding person.
“Every law abiding person”
-> Well… your law is not always another persons law, and they may not know all your laws…
I for one am not abiding the law right now. Because of administration, I have no health insurance right now… In my country you are obliged to have it…
I read most of these comments, more like 1/3 of the comments posted. Honestly, you guys talk about illegal immigrants not paying a “fair share”, shows how self-centered you are. I am offended by most of the comments that people make, especially since my parents immigrated here illegaly. My parents obtained their residency through some amnesty, but before that, had odd jobs where they would be ripped off by employers, even if it was under the table. So what am I trying to get at? Most people come to America to try an propser because in their country they would have a much harder time, people who live in Mexico, Guatemala, etc., have to be middle-class to even consider going to school. I don’t see how its any productive to vent off your frustrations on a couple of kids who obviously are intelligent and are putting their knowledge to good use. I personally applaud them for what they have achieved. They are an inspiration to many, including myself, who is a first generation american. I think you have to put politics aside and give them the merit they deserve. I know I will be contributing to their fund, because everyone deserves to go to school. Unless you are in their situation, or have parents who have been “undocumented” its difficult to understand. I hope some of you people open your eyes and put your biases aside and donate any amount of money. Anyway, if i made any grammar mistakes, so be it, I am tired. Thank you David Adams for the story.
I’m not reading all these comments but it seems obvious to me that the only real solution is for the Mexican government to snatch these guys and tell America: “You’re not getting this bunch!”
If Mexico managed to keep that kind of talent in their own country and give them something better to do than menial work when they are obviously smart enough to do a lot better in life if only given the chance, they could help make Mexico a country where people wouldn’t want to leave to get a ‘better’ life in the US.
I wholeheartedly concur with the people saying “send them back to Mexico” but not because they’re illegal in the US or that they are a burden on society and unfair competition. I would like to see them move back home because their country needs their quality of people.
Besides, the US is old and busted. With China taking over the Western world’s economy [a present by US CEOs and senior management by the way] there’s not going to be any chance of a decent career for these people anyway. They’ll be forever stuck paying for stupid costs to the detriment of investing in a better life for themselvels [education]. Why stay in a country that is only going to feel the very sharp sting of Asian competition in precious few years anyway?
When Oil is $250 a barrel and people are utterly and totally unable to pay for anything anymore why move to the US? Maybe a kid like that will finally do what the big corporations, with the clarity of vision of a filled-to-the-rim barf bag, have failed to manage: develop an engine that doesn’t need fossil fuel to drive with better fuel economy than what US cars manage. We’re still happy to get 45 miles to the gallon in 2005, sheesh. And you wonder why other countries are surpassing the good ole US of A?
“”What gives you the right to send anyone back?””
“-Two words. 9/11.”
Oh yeah right, here in Germany there are quite a lot of Russian people who are criminals. We should immediately send ppl that are not born in Germany to their countries. In your opinion for example all arabians are criminals just because there were 20 of them involved in 9/11? Sorry but that’s incredibly stupid and i hope that’s not what the maiority of the US Americans think.
“Sounds to me like you’ve been reading a little too much Carl Marx my friend.”
Do you actually know who Carl Marx was and what he stood for? There’s absolutely no connection between his statements and the Marxism. Ah yes and it’s Karl Marx not Carl Marx. Just to critise your spelling.
Here in Europe a lot of people (actually the most) think that the average US American doensn’t know were Europe takes place on the globe. That means we think you ppl don’t care about anyone else than your “so great nation”.
Statements like yours don’t really help to change that view.
i wonder how they afforded to build teh awesomest robot? robots are expensive to make.
I am really surprise how open and progressive is the people in the USA, I mean some Americans really need to start reading you could start with “Der Moloch” from Karlheinz Deschner, then again i guess many will only be able to read texts in English. I wonder if the Mayflower Pilgrims had greencards, or if the americans who start to invade Mexican territory ask before for a mexican visa?
Many things made USA big, but I think as much as you argue you can not deny that the more important was inmigration.
The biggest hipocresy is that you will not hesitate to make it a movie with a Disney end, even if the wpa likes the reality to be diferent.
I’m not donating because I’m a cheapskate. I don’t need to bring up the illegal immigration issue to make myself feel better for not wanting to donate. Ironically, my cheap ass ways probably fuel the demand for “undocumented workers”.
Hey , the law is the law, right? Hmm, looking back to when America was formed, wasn’t there a law saying you couldn’t meet and discuss forming your own country? Didn’t the Brits have you under their royal thumb? So , I guess all the people who died fighting and “liberating ” the country they loved, are criminals? And , during the civil war, wasn’t it legal to own, kill, breed, or trade a “niga”? So all those people who fought and died to end slavery were criminals too.
You know, stupidity and ignorance does happen all over the world, anywhere that people live together. The main difference is that the Western world use’s the majority of all the worlds resource, and that’s not going to go on forever. If you look back through history, everybody has had a kick at the cat, they were all on top of the world at one time or another. The fact is , none of them ever imagined that they would loose thier spot on top. If I was an american spouting off “send them back”, I’d be watching and listening for the sound of heavey breathing coming up hard from behind me. Hear that? It’s China, India, or whomever else is next. Think it won’t happen? Think again. I don’t hate America, after all , we’re nieghbours, aren’t we? I mean, sure you are trying to place us on the illegal list , too, gotta carry passports and submit to finger print and photo. But we are all just buddies, right?
There’s no doubt in anyone’s mind that the terrorist’s have indeed won the war. Just look at your foriegn and domestic policies since 9-11. As long as this trend continues to worsen, then there’s no doubt in my mind that the end is very close. She’s a house of cards, and it’s starting to tumble down. A society is judged by the treatment of those less fortunate. What started out as one those grand experiments, is now coming unravelled, and the thing that sucks worst is: I live right next door to you!
it’s sad to see all this closed minded stuff about deporting these students with such bright futures. they deserve a chance to succeed I don’t say that because their my fellow countrymen (i’m a mexican citizen and legaly in the usa), i think they and any others wether they be mexican, arabic, african, white, asian, etc all deserve a fair chance. you take all these illegal immigrants for granted who do alot for you and all that they ask is for a little respect and consideration. i’d like to see half of you working in fields, and in any hard a@@ jobs lots of illegal people do every day just to get by. these people are the backbone of the usa, without them you wouldn’t have alot of luxuries that you have today, i think these students deserve alot of respect and all the help that they need.
i have read all these posts and all i see is
1. the law is the law, let’s follow it or change it but not break it…
2. the law sucks, who cares what the law is if it’s wrong…
3. america sucks for having these debates but i am able to participate in this debate thanks to america so i shouldn’t be posting here anyways…
ok, so i haven’t seen anything really new in this debate since my last post and i wonder why it continues. there is a lot of name calling and cussing in here which isn’t needed. just look at the facts of the case.
go to the link and read the source. read some more about it. then decide for yourself if they are illegal or not. if you believe they are illegal then you have to decide for yourself if you support undermining the law of the land or not. if you do support undermining the law instead of speaking out and making change, maybe it’s time for you to move to a different country.
remember, laws did lead to things like blacks at the back of a bus or the holocost (as others in here want to point out) but it was only because people who could change those laws never spoke up. deal with this event in whatever legal way there is and then change the law so we don’t face an event like it again.
Belief has nothing to do with illegal status. They are smart individuals. They know that they do not have to pay taxes. They know that they can not be refused health care. They know that they can not be refused gradeschool and highschool. They can get student visas and apply for college like every other foreigner who wants to study in the U.S. If they were U.S. CITIZENS, they would be able to apply for many school loans, like I did, Pell grants and many other means of being able to pay for college. They have received all of the services that I as a citizen pay for. Consider that my donation.
I’m a 2nd generation American. My family has been in the U.S. since 1962. I pay taxes and don’t mind too much since I know what they pay for. I’m not against welfare, just abusing it. Note that my family came from dirt poor farmers in Europe, but one of the first things they did when they got to the U.S. was become citizens and to learn English as best they could.
NAFTA was a major and huge gift to both the Mexican economy and to the captains of manufacturing and the food industry in the U.S. It should be ended.
George Bush’s answer to those who worry about having their job out sourced: There are many great federal programs for furthering your education.
What happens when “educated” jobs get outsourced? Oh wait, they already are, engineering, programming, manufacturing, there is little left–slavery is making a comeback as indentured servitude to the service industry.
On the other hand, I bet all those morons who are scared about “their taxes”, give immigrant aliens a chance to pay taxes, do not treat ’em like shit, give ’em a chance. Then tell me how many of ’em do not pay. Kick those. Keep the rest.
You’ve obviously never been an immigran alien, which explains why most of the US Citizens never travel outside the US of A. They don’t know (or care) for the rest of the world. As someone said: The Eiffel tower is there, I’ve seen it!
I certainly cannot defend the U.S. in any way. There are some bad people in charge.
But let me say that anyone who pretends that the U.S. laws are drastically more unfair than those of other countries are delusional. In a democracy everybody gets what the majority deserves. And we all know what “the majority” is like.
Let’s take Mexico, for instance. Did you know that you can’t own property within 50 kilometers of the coast if you’re a foreigner? This basically includes all of the Baja Peninsula, where I used to live. This effected me directly. As a foreign child living legally in Mexico, I was only given the right to attend school after bribing numerous officials, forging documents and getting put back a grade.
As a foreigner in Mexico, you are completely excluded from social programs, including disaster relief food/water. And I mean foreigners living in the country legally.
Let’s face it: you can’t rely an a government, any government, to do what is right. Do not look towards the government for morality or you’ll end up a sad, disappointed person. Create a community or social structure of your own and rely on that.
That said, I sure hope these Robo-geniuses get into college.
It seams the most powerfull state of the world is under control . “Agents” and “slaves” (aka citizens) are scream – “everyone must be under control of the law”. Well, I see the point of the Architect of this state – it’s very good to have the predictable crowd which is under tight control. Even more, the crowd is self-orgnized and self-controled – I see it from some comments.
Disclaimer: I’m not an anarchist or someone of that kind. My idea is – there is always exceptions in all rules, it is natural, it is life. This is the case.
IF they are undocumented Mexican immigrants they should apply for green card/or visa and then worry about college. And if they are illeagle immigrants. How are they in public school in the first place if the school needs copy of birth certificate. They should be deported immediatly dont care how smart they are
P.S.: I’m sorry for my poor English.
First of all, as someone whose ancestors were brought to the U.S. by force, as slaves, I have no problem with others wanting to live there. The only people that really have any ‘right’ to say something about it are the Native Americans who had their land stolen and where murdered by invaders. But, yeah, with most of them gone, they now have no voice. Very convenient.
Secondly, as a US citizen that now lives aboard, it is absolutely senseless that the richest nation on Earth can not, or will not, make a college education available for free, or at least at a very low cost, to any citizen who wants it. The US has more than enough money and resources to cover it.
Here in New Zealand, where I live now, a college education only cost one on an average of $3,000 (NZD) per year, and it used to be free until about 1980. If a nation with only 4 million people can do that, I’m sure a nation with 250 million plus can manage it.
Instead, we waste all that money on guns, bombs and war, or flying to the Moon, Mars or floating around in space, when there are people literally starving to death in the US, every day. Or having to put up with substandard health care that actually kills them, instead of saving their lives. Or old people having to eat dog food because the Social Security check wont cover food AND rent.
I was left speechless by most of the comments read on this page. That might have been expected in the post-9/11 USA, but reading this I suddenly realize how far America has drifted. And it is quite scary. So much for the so often self-proclaimed ‘greatest country in the world’…
I hadn’t decided about sending some money to these guys. Now I have.
I’m from Mexico and I can’t believe what most of the comments said about this subject. I always thought that this kind of community was more “open mind”, but this is not the case. This kind of threatment it’s what the latin american inmigrants deserve for making all the work that the mighty americans don’t wan’t to do.
If you actually read through the entire article you will find thta these so-called ‘geniuses’ managed to construct a contraption from PVC piping and left over parts that won pretty much on dumb luck. It was in no sense of the word a robot. It was merely a tethered submersible controlled via a wire link.
Apart from a few students from MIT the competition included such illustrious engineering faculties as Cape Fear Community College.
They won because they wrote the best operating manual.
In fact if they hadn’t been poor illegal immigrants their achievement would have been considered quite trivial.
I feel sorry for thse kids but they aren’t latter day versions of Nicola Tesla or Michael Faraday. I can assure you if they were genuinely brilliant they would have no trouble finding sponsors.
//The only “people” I know who don’t pay taxes are usually 1)wealthy or 2)corporate “entity” both seem to go hand in hand. //
Oh, COME ON. If you HONESTLY BELIEVE that the “only” people who don’t pay taxes are the rich-n-famous, you’re an idiot.
FAR FAR FAR more “poor” people don’t pay taxes than “rich” people don’t pay taxes.
Stop being so god damn selfish over there, and embrace socialism for the better good of all Americans.
I’m surprised at the number of comments this story has received — and the amount of bigotry it’s revealed.
The real criminals aren’t the individuals trying to find ways to feed their families, but the policies in both the U.S. and Mexico that perpetuate these conditions and make it simultaneously necessary, illegal, and dangerous to earn a decent living.
If these people are criminals for trying to survive, then Martin Luther King, Jr. was a criminal for violating Jim Crow segregation laws.
Wow, lots of bashing on everyone.
So, do other countries pay for the education of people who entered their country w/out following immigration procedures? Just curious.
“I’m surprised at the number of comments this story has received — and the amount of bigotry it’s revealed.
The real criminals aren’t the individuals trying to find ways to feed their families, but the policies in both the U.S. and Mexico that perpetuate these conditions and make it simultaneously necessary, illegal, and dangerous to earn a decent living.
If these people are criminals for trying to survive, then Martin Luther King, Jr. was a criminal for violating Jim Crow segregation laws.”
What does this have to do with illegal immigrants who do not have U.S. Citizen, or Green Card or Student Visa Status, receiving the full benefits of those who do, who pay taxes to support them? The illegal aliens are getting a Free Ride at our expense. I don’t understand why people thing they should be applauded.
“The illegal aliens are getting a Free Ride at our expense.”
That’s bullshit. They add more money to the economy AND to the government than they get in return. WE are getting a free ride at THEIR expense, if the truth be known.
Then lets not get a free ride anymore by closing the border to all Illegal aliens, to, according to you, THEIR benefit.
“These kids are hardworking geniuses. They’re the kind of immigrant every nation should welcome.”
Frankly, if they are so smart, I can’t imagine they couldn’t get a scholarship back in their home country of Mexico.
It’s not like engineering geniuses are exactly beating down the doors to get INTO Mexico.
“The illegal aliens are getting a Free Ride at our expense.”
Read the news… the social security even plan its budget with the billions (!) collected from illegal immigrants (which use fake ID).
And don’t forget that these illegal workers are employed by legal Americans citizens or residents … who do not seem to wrap themself in the same pedant attitude as you do but more in the wealth of dollars gain from employing illegals.
The illegal aliens are being exploited, and it is tantamount to modern day slavery or indentured servitude. The workers are not subject to worker’s compensation, OSHA safety regulations and worker protections that LEGAL workers are, nevermind the fact that they do not receive fair wages.
The people who employ them exploit them, it’s disgusting. It is the ugly side of capitalisim, and it will never end. Once Mexico’s economy is built up and they are too expensive, manufacturing labor will move to Guatemala, Belize, Nicaragua or other 3rd world countries who’s standard of living is low and labor is cheap AND UNREGULATED so workers can be exploited (paid poorly, no safety regulations, and no disability insurance.) Unfortunately, there will ALWAYS be cheap labor, eventually Africa, once the governments are more stable, will be come your new manufacturing mecca of cheap labor.
Mexican illegal migrants contribute annually $7 billion to social security. Check your closest non-biased newspaper for stories on this issue every time. For most illegal employees, working illegally doesn’t mean you don’t have a SSN, it means you don’t get the benefits of it.
I NEVER reply to these types of posts but I had to take the time in this case. “Undocumented” is the politically correct way of saying “Ill-freaking-legal”!!! I’ld like the take the keyboard that I used to PAY my INCOME TAX with and break it off in the @$$ of anyone who wants Federal money to cover an Illegal anybody to do ANYTHING other than go directly to jail or possibly back across the border. If you want to donate $ so d@mn bad, set up a fund to help support the d@mn border patrol!!!
The irony here is that they created an underwater robot. Is this what they used to get into America?
Wow, IBM has some brilliant employees.
“The illegal aliens are being exploited, and it is tantamount to modern day slavery or indentured servitude. The workers are not subject to worker’s compensation, OSHA safety regulations and worker protections that LEGAL workers are, nevermind the fact that they do not receive fair wages.”
I’m going to spell things out because you seem to have trouble comprehending – i-l-l-e-g-a-l. Don’t expect the law to be on your side if you don’t get benefits that are extended to l-e-g-a-l citizens. I love how people act like helpless victims when it comes to this stuff – get a spine. There was a conscious decision made to enter the country illegally – shut up and live with the consequences, or go through legal channels like the rest of us did.
I agree with you
I’m not defending them, read my earlier posts.
It’s kind of funny but a liberal always ends up shouting racism whenever you disagree with them. Anyways, for all the liberals out there, explain this:
Question 1:
If a country can only afford to bring in x amount of immigrants, and y amount of immigrants want to come in where y = 100000x, how can you set up a fair system for people coming into the country?
Question 2:
If a country has deemed minimum wage at a certain level, and this certain level is deemed to be the lowest amount someone can make without living in poverty and driving the living standards down for the nation, why is it ok to pay 1/6th of that to illegal immigrants and what kind of effect does this have on the person or nation?
No amount of problems you might have however real or imaginary warrants having laws which deny basic human freedoms based on skin color, geographical location at birth or any other arbitrary parameter. All men are created equal.
Well, millions of immigrants, legal or illegal, are here, and won’t go anywhere(*). For the US it will be extremely risky to create a whole pariah social class, with no way to education/upward mobility access to health. If those brilliant kids see that playing by the rules and excelling don’t bring them rewards but frustration and racist condemnation, they are going to be very angry. So, for the own good of this society, open opportunities to them. Give them residence permits and let them go to College, to them and to all of the “illegals” that are studying and working hard. Tell your representatives that. Open this country in an orderly way, because in 30 years, this country is going to be brown, very brown, like it or not.
(*) Unless you really believe that mass deportations, jailings and executions are the answer.
No, you’ll find that the “so called engineers” at MIT built a device that completed more underwater tasks than any other entry.
And illegal immigrants would be lucky to land a job at Pizza Hut. They’re much more likely to be working fields, cleaning toilets, and cutting grass. High school kids and poor uneducated people pad the food service industry.
Eight trips to the U.S. and you still don’t know anything.
I’m not gonna add anything new but this was a great story about some exceptional kids who are dealing with the hand they are delt. It would be very sad if their potential was squandered.
Genius? Hardly. A brilliant high-school student would take the time to figure out how to become a legal citizen so that they could qualify for citizen benefits. Assembling pieces of machinery under water does not make you a genius. I would be more impressed if they could figure out the legal process for citizenship. And no, I don’t want my tax money spent on criminals.
What the crap in the world is “undocumented”? It’s ILLEGAL ALIENS, not immigrants. Sure, these kids may not have had the choice to come to US except to follow their parents, but what kind of crap is allowing them in public schools and letting them compete in these academic events? When my parents applied for student visa for me to attend MIDDLE school, they were asked to pay for the tax money normally would have paid by the “legal” taxpayers.. $3500!!!! That’s almost what my parents made in a year in the poor country. They paid it and worked hard to pay for it. And since I was in school legally, I was able to study hard, get good grades, get scholarships and loans to put myself through high school and college. Then when it came time for me to get a job, I spent almost 4 years and over $20000 in legal fees so I can get my green card. Now I’m a taxpaying resident in the USA, actually making enough money to support my family back home and have a family of my own AND support this country that gave me the opportunity by PAYING my taxes. It just sickens me that there are people who support and advocate a system that would send the message “look.. so and so sneaked across the border and they gave him money to go to school and you don’t have to pay for anything.. we should go too.”
@Jose
Hey you US citizens, residents or “white people”, how you like name you yourself.
I personally call my self an American NOT German-American,Irish-American, Dutch-American,Swiss-American nor Native-American all of which are titles i can use.
Also, Your skin color in a fair world don’t matter for anything, when you will learn it?
This is not a fair world retard haven’t you learned that yet? My skin color does matter by no choice of my own i had the misfortune of being born as the single most descriminated Race/Sex combination on the planet..the White male. Yet i don’t bitch about it all the time and sit around holding pity parties for myself nor do i feel anyone owes me anything like i see many so termed “Minorities” doing
I for one believe all anglo-saxon’s, native or not, should be deported back to their respective countries. They, white people, have encroached, mooched, and stole land. Stealing is still illegal, no? Pilgrim get your bags, you’re going home!
Your right! <sarcasm> and Italy owes me slave reparations for eslaving my ancestors during Roman occupation of what is now Germany and Switzerland. </sarcasm> Do the human race a favor and don’t reproduce.
Wow the reaction to this story is really awesome. I’m also against illegal immigration. How about you going back to Europe you nazis, racist bastards? But before doing that return California, Texas, New Mexico, etc to Mexico.
So the can promptly extend the Mexican third world shithole?
Then apologize to all native americans for all the stolen land and the murders your ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT PARENTS did.
I am sorry your civilization could not adapt properly to world changes :_( and that my ancestors that were farmers turned the land you weren’t using into a method to feed the worlds hungry people.
These continent belongs to native americans and blacks.
Your right there a alot of Americans of African and Native American decent that pay taxes and have a vested interest in America
You stole the land from them or you brought them here against their will. I guess I really don’t care about your taxes…
Okay then we have a prison cell for you.
Its amazing to how racism to most here means White people against everyone else. very scary…
Because it is full of bigots with a complete lack of knowledge on historical context.
Did YOUR ancestors get permission to immigrate? Possibly, more than likely they just immigrated anyway. Shot a few natives and claimed the land. Hypocrites.
I would be proud to have Can-Do folk like these young men settle in my country.
COME TO NEW ZEALAND, you’re too good for the States.
You have no room to talk! you guys made a whole people extinct some of the native new Zealand tribes. Ask anyone in your country how they feel about the “Blacks”. Hypocrite
This is a great story and I feel for these kids, but the in a time when our technology jobs are flowing out of the US at an ever increasing rate and corporations demand cheap labor and open borders should we really reward illegal immigration?
You can’t understand the government’s studied disinterest in illegal immigration without looking at the Free Trade at any price crowd pushing our trade policies.
When goods and services flow freely across countries without restriction, labor costs, will find an equilibrium, lower for American workers and higher for workers from Latin America. That means you may lose your high-tech job to India, or your low tech job to illegal aliens, and your children will face murderous competition for mind-numbing low-tech jobs because our elected representatives have made it profitable to to move jobs offshore.
I have nothing against Latin Americans, but I have real problems trading the financial future of America for short term economic gains by P&G, HP, GE, IBM and a host of other companies who no longer consider themselves to be American companies, but world companies.
You may not feel so magnanimous when you realize that politicians and corporations are coopereating to increase stock prices no matter the cost.
We’re paying the cost of illegal immigration and our children will pay the price.
I suggest Mexico sponsor a project for these kids.
Stop being so god damn selfish over there, and embrace socialism for the better good of all Americans.
There would be a civil war in America before European style Socialism ever exists in the US. I am sure you wouldn’t want that
Yes… you don’t want “illegal aliens” in USA. OK. But.. the money? How about the money?
Mexico has a stupid government, and this government allows all that Mexico-Americans business man getting more and more rich and the whole people in Mexico getting poor. All that richs has the control in Mexican economy and politics. Look for yourself:
http://www.amcham.com.mx/
How do you explain that only 10 mens has all the politics and economy and fate of 100,000,000 of habitants in their
hands? Yes, in Mexico there are many money. The money is not distributed between all the working people. The richest just use the politics, economy, and religion, so thay can… steal?.. all the money that they want, living from the welding of the poor and paying a very low wage.
Yes… Maybe you, american citizen are just wonder
“why in the f*** Mexican people allows that??”
I would be very happy with a second revolution. A change of laws, something more just for all people here. Getting some from that 10 richest guys and do something with that money.
But just imagine what would happen:
The USA will send inmediatly your marines, to impose your government, business and politics paid by USA government in “liberty and democracy” name and Vs. “oppresion and tirany”. Just like your done with Cuba. Or Nicaragua.
And guess why? Cause your government will protect all your McDonalds, CocaCola, BurgerKing and many many business that you have here. Your government has very fine business oppotunities in Mexico. So, you will protect the Mexican government from a Revolution or the like. How would yo do yer great business without the support of Mexican government?
Illegal aliens? It is just a secondary effect of actions from the Puppet-like Mexican government driven by American Government.
Dear Anonymous (IP: —.dialup.mindspring.com):
“What our ancestors did so that we exist where we exist has no intrinsic value upon the mores of today”
Exactly, that boys are under 18, and what their parents did isn’t their fault.
Historically when pilgrims and any european came there was a law in the country, as you know native north americans has their laws, they respected nature, and it was god, and the people that arrive and build USA didn’t respect that. “Just like now”.
Mexico has a stupid government, and this government allows all that Mexico-Americans business man getting more and more rich and the whole people in Mexico getting poor. All that richs has the control in Mexican economy and politics.
Very true so how can we help you change that?
The USA will send inmediatly your marines, to impose your government, business and politics paid by USA government in “liberty and democracy” name and Vs. “oppresion and tirany”. Just like your done with Cuba. Or Nicaragua.
Huge difference my friend what you are talking about is communist insurgents. I as an american i would be all for Mexicans standing up for whats right and fighting(peacefully preferably but not required) to improve the situation and well being of its citizens how can we help? Just don’t walk down the crooked path of Neo-Socialism.
>>Very true so how can we help you change that?
You can’t neither must help us. This is something that we as mexicans must fix.
>>Huge difference my friend what you are talking about is >>communist insurgents. I as an american i would be all for >>Mexicans standing up for whats right and fighting(peacefully >>preferably but not required) to improve the situation and >>well being of its citizens how can we help? Just don’t walk >>down the crooked path of Neo-Socialism.
And what if Mexican people want to follow the neo-socialism? If it’s better for all Mexican People, why not? Cause that isnn’t Ok for you?
The capitalism is the best…. when you lives in USA or are rich.
The article is obviously written in a way that portrays a fantasy come true kind of feeling. Its more like a fiction story provoking readers to think a certain way then its news stating facts. Now a days, your dog chewing a bone can become the next american idol by the media and your neighbor’s dog speaking 7 languages is nothing more than just a pet without the coverage.
Genius? While I do think they have worked hard and maybe talented individuals, their accomplishment does not even come close to the term Genius in my book.
Legal/Illegal Aliens? Its one sensitive topic but I have to say i’m against illegal immigrants. Everyone wants a better living standard for themselves and their family, but if everyone is doing it the illegal way then there will only be chaos. And i especially dislike the media coverage of some particularly touching individual cases and applying to everyone that might have some similar status or experiences.
Illegal Immigrants Contributing to the country? No doubt economically they do contribute, but i believe the cost for them is just as much of not more. I just recently find out that they get free health/dental/vision for free or cheap too at communities clinics. How they do that i don’t know, but i do know somebody is paying for it. On a side note, I pay thousands in healthcare coverage alone yearly and i get crappy coverage.
Final thought. I have nothing against illegal immigrants but i do not support any form of aide for them whether state or federal. Illegal is unlawful and laws need to be upheld in any society. If individuals want to donate i have no problem, who am i to say what you can do with your own money. But any government fundings are for its citizens and legal immigrants.
just my 2 cents.
bsdero, apparently a Mexican has posted the most accurate and honest post of the 302 here.
My guess is that all of those who are against these bright people
and are for deporting them are all mediocre americans who haven’t built an underwater robot that beats top US universties, and are mostly jealous. C’mon people, stop being idiots, the US benefits from these bright “inmigrants”, and the US is a nation of inmigration. All of you are inmigrants, except the native americans. And you didn’t come to the US with a visa. Most contributions to the US have been done by bright inmigrants. And they do contribute. Some americans are so hypocrite as to say they’re against illegal inmigration, and yet give jobs to illegal inmigrants, like that republican senator.
Let them become citizens and they will have my utmost respect. The bright immigrants you speak of, became citizens.
The only crime around is the “I am the best” attitude that most US of A citizens expose. Just because “your” country is the #1 power, that doesn’t mean anything AT ALL.
Actually, I think it means we are the number one power. Sorry if you’re having trouble dealing with that. You really should not go out of your way to insult me and my fellow countrymen just because you have some sort of inferiority complex.
Now as far as these kids are concerned, I have the utmost sympathy for them and their plight but the immigration laws are there for a reason. Should start taking the intelligence quotient of a defendant into consideration during a criminal trial? Should smart people just get a free pass? I think not.
These people who are against these students are probably rush limbaugh listeners
My skin color does matter by no choice of my own i had the misfortune of being born as the single most descriminated Race/Sex combination on the planet..the White male
You must be joking…
Mexican immigrants can be drafted, if nessacary, to fight in the United States Armed Forces; you do not have to be a citizen.
Many Mexican illegals do pay taxes, and their children should atleast be allowed to attend public school. I am not for wanton violation of immigration laws, but I feel they do deserve some rights afforded to citizens specifically, the right for an education.
Personally I did not think of this as a race issue, but a common-sense issue. These high-school kids out engineered university students from the most prestidgious engineering school on the planet. They obviously deserve some sort of higher education, whether it is in Mexico or at MIT.
You guys should read Tim Wises’ (http://www.timwise.org/), “White Like Me : Reflections on Race from a Privileged Son”, book. It’s really interesting and gives you an insight to what it’s like to be an American white.
If I were white, I too would probably be a rabid Mexican^H^H^H^H^Himmigrant^H^H^H^H^H^Illegal immagrant hater. It’s this thing that white men get off on trying to feel morally superior or somehow civilized to their fellow man. These same men however have no qualms about hiring illegals, buying “illegal” drugs, or fighting illegal wars.
To tell the truth I for one would never do business with IBM or hire “SmartPatrol” after reading all the mess that has gone on here … it’s truely pathetic.
Most of the people who come from these countries, like nicaragua and salvador, come because their countries were blown into pieces by “strategic” wars by the mighty US. So I guess, it’s like they’re returning the favor. The US interfered and put in brutal dictators in those countries, driving them to poverty and chaos. So much for legality.
The US is racist, they break international laws, like when invading a country illegaly, and they torture too, like in Abu Giraf. And nobody is held accountable for that. So much for legality.
Most grants are need-based. There are many that are meritoriously awarded, but they are certainly not the greater in number.
You people are all arguing against straw men. It doesn’t matter if immigrants, or illegal immigrants are “taking jobs.” They’re in the U.S. contrary to its immigration laws, and as such they’re never going to obtain the respect of the citizenry.
And that people support this practice because they feel that people from the U.S. are racist or selfish is retarded.
Being an illegal in the U.S. is not a picnic. They get shit jobs where they’re exploited by selfish people that actually want them here illegally and support both political parties in preventing tight control of immigration or immigration policy reform. If one of them is is lucky it gets to be the nanny or groundskeeper for some rich family, and if not it gets to pick fruit or work like a mule.
They don’t get good health services, and end up needing ER care that both costs everyone more and may be too late to prevent permanent damage. They get to live in constant fear of having their families deported. They get to watch their children miss out on opportunities.
And you support this casual, poorly-regulated, second-class lifestyle with specious reasoning. Even though it breeds a segregated class of society, undermines national security, and causes border states economic trouble. Even though it probably breeds resentment among some for legal immigrants.
For the most part I don’t think many of you actually give a shit about these people. I think you just have some disdain for U.S. citizens or Caucasians that is both childish and not particularly helpful.
“These people who are against these students are probably rush limbaugh listeners”
Heh… Actually, I am a hardcore environmentalist, which most associate with the left. And guess what? A nation cannot protect their environment while at the same time allowing unrestricted immigration.
Well, you could use some beeps in your posts. Maybe you wouldn’t be moderated ?
http://news.com.com/U.S.+slips+lower+in+coding+contest/2100-1022_3-…
yes I would, they don’t like me here.
I call them out, but no one knows because they delete my posts and ban me when I do.
Why should I beep anything, my rights under supreme court ruling allow me to drop the f-bomb any time I want.
Mexican immigrants can be drafted, if nessacary, to fight in the United States Armed Forces; you do not have to be a citizen.
Yes Legal immigrants i served with some myself whats your point again?
Personally I did not think of this as a race issue, but a common-sense issue. These high-school kids out engineered university students from the most prestidgious engineering school on the planet. They obviously deserve some sort of higher education, whether it is in Mexico or at MIT.
I did not bring up the race issue others didi just made some personal observations and clarified a few things. The do deserve to be rewarded for their achievments. If they want to attend college in the states they need to go through proper legal channels like every other foriegner that goes to school in the states does! Becasue these kids are from a country that borders ours they deserve preferential treatment over someone from India? Iran? Germany? Turkey? sheez people think. If i were a brilliant person from India for example(there are quite a few) i would be seriously pissed.
[i]To tell the truth I for one would never do business with IBM or hire “SmartPatrol” after reading all the mess that has gone on here … it’s truely pathetic.
First off my opinions are my own and have nothing to do with IBM or any company i work for. Second there are reason we have laws if we bend them and twist them just to get a warm fuzzy from time to time then what we would have is called anarchy. I am all for people coming ot this country to pursue something better and i will be the first person to hold out my hand to help anyone that wants to do it THROUGH PROPER LEGAL CHANNELS. I have friends that have done this one of them was from croatia to him its was one of the greatest things becoming an American after what he went through in his home country with the Serbs. Stories like the topic of this thread spit in his and his families face and that pisses me off to no end. Third if you were in a position to hire i am sure i would be passed over based on some affirmitave action quota that you would have to fill no matter what my qualifications are.
“sorry if your people did not adapt to change” by smartpatrol.
If by “adapt” you mean massacring them and put them in reservations, then yes, they didnt adapt. would you have adapted?
Then US companies doing business in many, specially underdeveloped countries around the world, extracting resources, money, oil, etc, and destroying the enviroment of those countries, should also
pack up and leave those countries, since most of them got there through illegal contracts with shoddy crooked governments in those countries, and most of those governments were placed by the US, so.
Inmigration whether “legal or not” is good for the us, if a global market economy and complete open free trade(meaning US companies extracting resources in those countries) is good for those underdeveloped economies, as the US likes to say through their mouthpieces, ie. the FMI, the world bank.
There was a few years back a story about some dude who wanted to apply for a job as a police officer in the US, and was told by the recruiters that
he was “too qualified” for the job, because he was too smart and would probably get bored by the job, and that he would quit soon after getting the job. He filed lawsuit, and the ruling was against him, because the law does not contemplate discriminating “smart people”. So the law maybe should be amended, since it overrules all common sense.